5 ms·

I used to love gog. I purchased a bunch of stuff back when they were talking a big game around supporting Linux with their Galaxy client. But while gog was tal

by fooqux 9mo ago

I used to love gog. I purchased a bunch of stuff back when they were talking a big game around supporting Linux with their Galaxy client. But while gog was talking, Valve was actually doing. Building an actual Linux client. Making multiplayer actually work. Not to mention all the work they've done with Proton and upstreamimg graphics drivers. I hope gog succeeds. I just value Linux gaming support over not having DRM. It's kinda a idealist vs realist stance for me.

pitched 9mo ago
It doesn’t look like GOG can afford to pay for that work. I think we all got very lucky that the success of the Steam Deck has put the incentives in the right place for Steam to be able to invest in Linux.
- SXX 9mo ago
  Valve started to invest in Linux and open source 10 years before releasing Steam Deck. They started hiring OSS developers back in 2012 and Deck released in 2022: https://www.phoronix.com/review/valve_linux_dampfnudeln https://www.phoronix.com/review/valve_linux_dampfnudeln
  - pitched 9mo ago
    The Steam Machine (Steam Deck predecessor) had leaks/announcements in 2013 and shipped in 2015 so that lines up.
- PoignardAzur 9mo ago
  Saying "we're lucky" makes it sound like Valve's investment in Linux is a happy accident, but as you point out, the Steam Machine was announced in 2013, and back them gaming on Linux was seen as a pie in the sky dream. Headlines at the time said things like "Valve’s Steam Machines look dead in the water", there was barely any market demand, and they probably lost a lot on the initial release. The fact that they still doubled down and spent ten years funding the Linux ecosystem before it made them any money speaks of both a strategic incentive (they don't want Microsoft to hold a sword over their neck) and ideological vision (they want gaming to stay relatively open). Saying "we all got very lucky that the success of the Steam Deck has put the incentives in the right place for Steam to be able to invest in Linux" is getting the causality backwards at the very least. Valve investing in Linux is what made the Steam Deck's success remotely possible, and it wasn't a sure shot.
deleted 9mo ago
[deleted]
TechSquidTV 9mo ago
The unfortunate or fortunate reality of network effects also means Steam is usually best suited to preserve content that might otherwise be lost. Both in terms of literally holding the data for longer than the general public (including workshop files), but also by keeping communities active and alive.
Gormo 9mo ago
There are tons of Linux games distributed on GOG, and not having to use a proprietary client is one of its great advantages. Not to downplay Valve's contributions (and I may well get a Steam Frame when they come out), but they mostly amount to porting their mandatory DRM-laden client to Linux, and maintaining a fork of Wine that integrates with that client. Ownership, control, and privacy are among the main reasons I use Linux, and are likewise huge advantages that GOG has over Steam.
- sanskritical 9mo ago
  Official Linux releases are almost never maintained. I have the same game on Steam and GOG, but the GOG version no longer works. Neither does the Steam version, except if I switch to the Windows version with Proton. Then it works flawlessly (usually faster and better than the Linux version ever did.)
  - fooqux 9mo ago
    Sadly I've had the same experience. I've had to rebuy a couple games on steam because the older gog version wasn't version compatible with my friend's clients. That really burned my bottom.
    - sanskritical 9mo ago
      Yes, it is so bad that I will no longer buy a game for its Linux release. Almost every single Linux game I have outside of actual Valve titles no longer works. I don't want to hear that they have a Linux release. I want to hear that they have a Windows release that works with Proton. Windows is the only ABI that I can expect to reliably run on Linux.
      - Gormo 9mo ago
        I've been gaming primarily on Linux for almost 15 years, and buying from GOG as my first choice, and have never encountered a single instance of what you're describing. I don't have a single Linux game on my GOG account that "no longer works", and I have dozens of Linux games there. In fact the only time I recall a Linux-native game not working out of the box was when I got the game 'The Raven: Legacy of a Master Thief' on Steam, and that was due to some wonky configuration implemented by the game devs. Do you have any specific examples of this problem?
tracerbulletx 9mo ago
I think it's perfectly realistic to think there is a substantial risk of losing library content you've bought on Valve in the next 20 years. Don't know what the odds are, but they're greater than zero.
- fooqux 9mo ago
  I personally think that, between the two, gog is far more likely to disappear than steam. I'm happy both exist. I've nothing against gog (except maybe for their broken promises around Linux support, but I do understand changing market forces) and like I said, I hope they succeed. They've got a good mission.
  - RoyalHenOil 9mo ago
    GOG might disappear, but your games won't. If Steam disappears, your games will become inaccessible.
    - internetter 9mo ago
      It's actually mostly the same in both cases. If steam or GOG goes down, you can no longer download the games you bought. But what about the games you have downloaded? Well GOG games will work out of the box, however the steam "DRM" is really just basic protection to stop you from copying the files to your friend's computer, and can easily be removed by already existing tools like Steamless and Goldberg Emulator. So I'm not really that worried about the vast majority of my steam library. The only thing I'd worry about is spiking storage costs when steam's demise seems imminent!
- BadBadJellyBean 9mo ago
  I will pirate every game I have in my steam library that I want to play if that is ever the case. Without the a moment of hesitation. I payed for it.
  - pamcake 9mo ago
    [dead]
its-summertime 9mo ago
There is only 1 Steam client for Linux, and there will only ever be one client, and that client has had basic issues (context menus being a completely new window that steals focus, comes to mind instantly) that have been unresolved year after year. For GOG, there are plenty of clients for Linux [1][2][3][4], And they are open source, I can go and talk to the people making these clients directly, I can give feedback, I can make changes to make these clients better (and to a small degree, I already have). [1]: https://sharkwouter.github.io/minigalaxy/ https://sharkwouter.github.io/minigalaxy/ [2]: https://sites.google.com/site/gogdownloader/ https://sites.google.com/site/gogdownloader/ [3]: https://heroicgameslauncher.com/ https://heroicgameslauncher.com/ [4]: https://www.hyperplay.xyz/ https://www.hyperplay.xyz/
- dundarious 9mo ago
  This is true, but there are pros and cons. Pro 1: reduced lockin Pro 2: open source options Con 1: not all options are all that easy to use or feature complete, making the "choice" a mandatory QA/research task, rather than a way to exercise personal taste/freedom Con 2: no galaxy-only features like achievements and save file cloud sync (My personal testing led to choosing Heroic)
- jeroenhd 9mo ago
  It took me seven tries across two years to get Cyberpunk 2077 playing on Linux using either raw install files with or without Lutris/Bottles, GOG Galaxy in a wine env, or whatever Heroic Launcher offers. I'm glad it mostly works now, but i would've been better off buying it from Valve. The effort Valve put into making games Just Work is unparalleled. The minor UI issues (like context menus getting rendered in place as windows which breaks niche window managers) are nothing compared to the hours required to brute force the right Wine/Proton setup for every game to make it work. Most of the games that now work in unofficial GOG launchers only work because Valve paid someone to make games run well on Wine, either by directly using Proton or by using one of the many libraries Valve has directly paid for work for.
  - npodbielski 9mo ago
    Did you try lutris?
eleveriven 9mo ago
Valve earned a lot of goodwill by actually shipping things that made Linux gaming viable day-to-day, not just promising it

by fooqux 9mo ago

pitched 9mo ago

It doesn’t look like GOG can afford to pay for that work. I think we all got very lucky that the success of the Steam Deck has put the incentives in the right place for Steam to be able to invest in Linux.

SXX 9mo ago
Valve started to invest in Linux and open source 10 years before releasing Steam Deck. They started hiring OSS developers back in 2012 and Deck released in 2022: https://www.phoronix.com/review/valve_linux_dampfnudeln https://www.phoronix.com/review/valve_linux_dampfnudeln
- pitched 9mo ago
  The Steam Machine (Steam Deck predecessor) had leaks/announcements in 2013 and shipped in 2015 so that lines up.
PoignardAzur 9mo ago
Saying "we're lucky" makes it sound like Valve's investment in Linux is a happy accident, but as you point out, the Steam Machine was announced in 2013, and back them gaming on Linux was seen as a pie in the sky dream. Headlines at the time said things like "Valve’s Steam Machines look dead in the water", there was barely any market demand, and they probably lost a lot on the initial release. The fact that they still doubled down and spent ten years funding the Linux ecosystem before it made them any money speaks of both a strategic incentive (they don't want Microsoft to hold a sword over their neck) and ideological vision (they want gaming to stay relatively open). Saying "we all got very lucky that the success of the Steam Deck has put the incentives in the right place for Steam to be able to invest in Linux" is getting the causality backwards at the very least. Valve investing in Linux is what made the Steam Deck's success remotely possible, and it wasn't a sure shot.

deleted 9mo ago

[deleted]

TechSquidTV 9mo ago

The unfortunate or fortunate reality of network effects also means Steam is usually best suited to preserve content that might otherwise be lost. Both in terms of literally holding the data for longer than the general public (including workshop files), but also by keeping communities active and alive.

Gormo 9mo ago

There are tons of Linux games distributed on GOG, and not having to use a proprietary client is one of its great advantages. Not to downplay Valve's contributions (and I may well get a Steam Frame when they come out), but they mostly amount to porting their mandatory DRM-laden client to Linux, and maintaining a fork of Wine that integrates with that client. Ownership, control, and privacy are among the main reasons I use Linux, and are likewise huge advantages that GOG has over Steam.

sanskritical 9mo ago
Official Linux releases are almost never maintained. I have the same game on Steam and GOG, but the GOG version no longer works. Neither does the Steam version, except if I switch to the Windows version with Proton. Then it works flawlessly (usually faster and better than the Linux version ever did.)
- fooqux 9mo ago
  Sadly I've had the same experience. I've had to rebuy a couple games on steam because the older gog version wasn't version compatible with my friend's clients. That really burned my bottom.
  - sanskritical 9mo ago
    Yes, it is so bad that I will no longer buy a game for its Linux release. Almost every single Linux game I have outside of actual Valve titles no longer works. I don't want to hear that they have a Linux release. I want to hear that they have a Windows release that works with Proton. Windows is the only ABI that I can expect to reliably run on Linux.
    - Gormo 9mo ago
      I've been gaming primarily on Linux for almost 15 years, and buying from GOG as my first choice, and have never encountered a single instance of what you're describing. I don't have a single Linux game on my GOG account that "no longer works", and I have dozens of Linux games there. In fact the only time I recall a Linux-native game not working out of the box was when I got the game 'The Raven: Legacy of a Master Thief' on Steam, and that was due to some wonky configuration implemented by the game devs. Do you have any specific examples of this problem?

tracerbulletx 9mo ago

I think it's perfectly realistic to think there is a substantial risk of losing library content you've bought on Valve in the next 20 years. Don't know what the odds are, but they're greater than zero.

fooqux 9mo ago
I personally think that, between the two, gog is far more likely to disappear than steam. I'm happy both exist. I've nothing against gog (except maybe for their broken promises around Linux support, but I do understand changing market forces) and like I said, I hope they succeed. They've got a good mission.
- RoyalHenOil 9mo ago
  GOG might disappear, but your games won't. If Steam disappears, your games will become inaccessible.
  - internetter 9mo ago
    It's actually mostly the same in both cases. If steam or GOG goes down, you can no longer download the games you bought. But what about the games you have downloaded? Well GOG games will work out of the box, however the steam "DRM" is really just basic protection to stop you from copying the files to your friend's computer, and can easily be removed by already existing tools like Steamless and Goldberg Emulator. So I'm not really that worried about the vast majority of my steam library. The only thing I'd worry about is spiking storage costs when steam's demise seems imminent!
BadBadJellyBean 9mo ago
I will pirate every game I have in my steam library that I want to play if that is ever the case. Without the a moment of hesitation. I payed for it.
- pamcake 9mo ago
  [dead]

its-summertime 9mo ago

There is only 1 Steam client for Linux, and there will only ever be one client, and that client has had basic issues (context menus being a completely new window that steals focus, comes to mind instantly) that have been unresolved year after year. For GOG, there are plenty of clients for Linux [1][2][3][4], And they are open source, I can go and talk to the people making these clients directly, I can give feedback, I can make changes to make these clients better (and to a small degree, I already have). [1]: https://sharkwouter.github.io/minigalaxy/ https://sharkwouter.github.io/minigalaxy/ [2]: https://sites.google.com/site/gogdownloader/ https://sites.google.com/site/gogdownloader/ [3]: https://heroicgameslauncher.com/ https://heroicgameslauncher.com/ [4]: https://www.hyperplay.xyz/ https://www.hyperplay.xyz/

dundarious 9mo ago
This is true, but there are pros and cons. Pro 1: reduced lockin Pro 2: open source options Con 1: not all options are all that easy to use or feature complete, making the "choice" a mandatory QA/research task, rather than a way to exercise personal taste/freedom Con 2: no galaxy-only features like achievements and save file cloud sync (My personal testing led to choosing Heroic)
jeroenhd 9mo ago
It took me seven tries across two years to get Cyberpunk 2077 playing on Linux using either raw install files with or without Lutris/Bottles, GOG Galaxy in a wine env, or whatever Heroic Launcher offers. I'm glad it mostly works now, but i would've been better off buying it from Valve. The effort Valve put into making games Just Work is unparalleled. The minor UI issues (like context menus getting rendered in place as windows which breaks niche window managers) are nothing compared to the hours required to brute force the right Wine/Proton setup for every game to make it work. Most of the games that now work in unofficial GOG launchers only work because Valve paid someone to make games run well on Wine, either by directly using Proton or by using one of the many libraries Valve has directly paid for work for.
- npodbielski 9mo ago
  Did you try lutris?

eleveriven 9mo ago

Valve earned a lot of goodwill by actually shipping things that made Linux gaming viable day-to-day, not just promising it