5 ms·

Indeed - the system as a whole is starting to feel bloated. Today’s macOS design is akin to the cosmetic mufflers/exhaust pipes in cars, which serve only to jus

Indeed - the system as a whole is starting to feel bloated. Today’s macOS design is akin to the cosmetic mufflers/exhaust pipes in cars, which serve only to justify the “Sport” badge. I long for the days past.

socalgal2 10mo ago
It's felt bloated for a while. Everytime I setup a new Mac I have to remove all of the icons from the doc. A new Dell isn't that bloated.
- jakeydus 10mo ago
  > a new Dell isn’t that bloated. At least a new Mac doesn’t try to serve you ads in the app launcher.
  - muro 10mo ago
    what about iCloud and News?
    - jakeydus 10mo ago
      I was specifically referring to ads for third party applications in the start menu, so you’re technically correct and I should have been more specific. I’d argue that those are upsells for the OS to enhance existing apps and systems. Not my favorite, but preferable to windows telling me to install candy crush in the start menu.
  - hagbard_c 10mo ago
    A new ${computer_brand} with Linux doesn't show you any ads, doesn't add more bloat than you let it, doesn't insist on you creating any iCloudy or Microsofty accounts, doesn't try to police what software you run on the thing, doesn't try to upsell you to some ${precious_metal} plan, doesn't insist your 5 year new computer is obsolete, doesn't spy on you, etcetera. What are you waiting for?
    - dundundundun 10mo ago
      Proper sleep.
      - hagbard_c 10mo ago
        Works fine for me, on Fruit Factory hardware even. Close the thing, it goes to sleep. Open it, it wakes up. Leave it closed for a very very long time and it hibernates. Open it again and it comes back to life. Your experience may vary depending on what hardware you run it on but for me it works fine on the mentioned machines, on a HP Spectre 360, another HP Elitebook and on a really ancient Toshiba Satellite. I've had problems with sleep on a Thinkpad P50 with a discrete NVidia Quattro GPU, it goes to sleep but won't wake up so I have that machine set to hibernate as soon as the lid is closed. This takes a bit longer (but not that long, SSD is fast) but it would have been more pleasant to use if normal sleep worked as intended.
      - db48x 10mo ago
        If your computer fails to sleep, or fails to wake up correctly after sleeping, when running Linux then the problem is almost always the hardware manufacturer’s fault. Many motherboards come with frankly broken ACPI tables that should never have made it out of QA. Remember this (<https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45271484 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45271484>) recent story? This is just the tip of the iceberg. For every well–researched story we have about ACPI problems there are a dozen more that are quietly fixed by Linux kernel developers (who instruct the kernel to simply ignore the broken ACPI tables and write a custom kernel driver to do the work instead) and an unknown but presumably large number that never come to the attention of a kernel developer.
        FeloniousHam 10mo ago
        It's not that Linux is "bad" when the hardware is incompatible, it's not "Linux's fault". It's that, at a certain age, I don't want to spend my precious few hours of free time working _on_ my computer, I just want it to work. (big fan of MacOS, and esp. third-party Mac software, the quality of which simply does not exist on any other platform) (Also, I have huge affection for Linux. I used Linux exclusively for years personally, and any place I could sneak it into my work environment)
  - DetectDefect 10mo ago
    Every macOS update I have installed this year is followed by a full-screen intrusive advertisement for Apple "Intelligence" which has to be dismissed before I am granted access to my own computer and files.
- runjake 10mo ago
  This is my shining moment! I just happened to setup a new Dell. It was far more cumbersome than dealing with a new Mac. Here's some of the stuff I had to do on my new Dell, from memory: - Uninstall all the bloatware apps that come installed with Windows 11. They nag and beg you not to uninstall them, but after several prompts, they mostly seem uninstalled? - Remove the trial offers from the Start menu. - Remove the third-party stub apps from the Start menu (eg. TikTok). - Remove the O365 stub apps. - Remove the McAfee antivirus payware. - Remove Dell SupportAssist from the laptop. - Then, just reinstall Windows 11 from scratch, because of all the remaining detritus left after performing the above steps. And uninstalling SupportAssist caused some instability and weird errors upon login. - Uninstall all the bloatware apps the come installed with Windows 11 again. - Remove the trial offers from the Start menu. - Remove the third-party stub apps from the Start menu (eg. TikTok). - Remove the O365 stub apps. Compared to on my Mac: - Remove apps from the Dock - Go into /Applications and uninstall about 6 Apple apps I don't use.
  - TacticalCoder 10mo ago
    > Here's some of the stuff I had to do on my new Dell, from memory: Or, you know, just format the disk and install Linux.
    - runjake 10mo ago
      If it were my choice…
      - wltr 10mo ago
        How is it you could reinstall Windows, but not Linux? Or is it just mandatory to run Windows, but nobody cares if you reinstall it? My wife’s Windows laptop won’t allow me to even run Logitech Connect Utility, to reconnect some devices (pair a keyboard to the mouse). It surely won’t allow the full reinstall, it’s locked entirely. Hence, I’m curious what’s up with your work (I assume) laptop.
        runjake 10mo ago
mlrtime 10mo ago
It's time to buy a new phone then! Surely that new phone won't feel so bloated, rinse and repeat.

socalgal2 10mo ago

It's felt bloated for a while. Everytime I setup a new Mac I have to remove all of the icons from the doc. A new Dell isn't that bloated.

jakeydus 10mo ago
> a new Dell isn’t that bloated. At least a new Mac doesn’t try to serve you ads in the app launcher.
- muro 10mo ago
  what about iCloud and News?
  - jakeydus 10mo ago
    I was specifically referring to ads for third party applications in the start menu, so you’re technically correct and I should have been more specific. I’d argue that those are upsells for the OS to enhance existing apps and systems. Not my favorite, but preferable to windows telling me to install candy crush in the start menu.
- hagbard_c 10mo ago
  A new ${computer_brand} with Linux doesn't show you any ads, doesn't add more bloat than you let it, doesn't insist on you creating any iCloudy or Microsofty accounts, doesn't try to police what software you run on the thing, doesn't try to upsell you to some ${precious_metal} plan, doesn't insist your 5 year new computer is obsolete, doesn't spy on you, etcetera. What are you waiting for?
  - dundundundun 10mo ago
    Proper sleep.
    - hagbard_c 10mo ago
      Works fine for me, on Fruit Factory hardware even. Close the thing, it goes to sleep. Open it, it wakes up. Leave it closed for a very very long time and it hibernates. Open it again and it comes back to life. Your experience may vary depending on what hardware you run it on but for me it works fine on the mentioned machines, on a HP Spectre 360, another HP Elitebook and on a really ancient Toshiba Satellite. I've had problems with sleep on a Thinkpad P50 with a discrete NVidia Quattro GPU, it goes to sleep but won't wake up so I have that machine set to hibernate as soon as the lid is closed. This takes a bit longer (but not that long, SSD is fast) but it would have been more pleasant to use if normal sleep worked as intended.
    - db48x 10mo ago
      If your computer fails to sleep, or fails to wake up correctly after sleeping, when running Linux then the problem is almost always the hardware manufacturer’s fault. Many motherboards come with frankly broken ACPI tables that should never have made it out of QA. Remember this (<https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45271484 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45271484>) recent story? This is just the tip of the iceberg. For every well–researched story we have about ACPI problems there are a dozen more that are quietly fixed by Linux kernel developers (who instruct the kernel to simply ignore the broken ACPI tables and write a custom kernel driver to do the work instead) and an unknown but presumably large number that never come to the attention of a kernel developer.
      - FeloniousHam 10mo ago
        It's not that Linux is "bad" when the hardware is incompatible, it's not "Linux's fault". It's that, at a certain age, I don't want to spend my precious few hours of free time working _on_ my computer, I just want it to work. (big fan of MacOS, and esp. third-party Mac software, the quality of which simply does not exist on any other platform) (Also, I have huge affection for Linux. I used Linux exclusively for years personally, and any place I could sneak it into my work environment)
- DetectDefect 10mo ago
  Every macOS update I have installed this year is followed by a full-screen intrusive advertisement for Apple "Intelligence" which has to be dismissed before I am granted access to my own computer and files.
runjake 10mo ago
This is my shining moment! I just happened to setup a new Dell. It was far more cumbersome than dealing with a new Mac. Here's some of the stuff I had to do on my new Dell, from memory: - Uninstall all the bloatware apps that come installed with Windows 11. They nag and beg you not to uninstall them, but after several prompts, they mostly seem uninstalled? - Remove the trial offers from the Start menu. - Remove the third-party stub apps from the Start menu (eg. TikTok). - Remove the O365 stub apps. - Remove the McAfee antivirus payware. - Remove Dell SupportAssist from the laptop. - Then, just reinstall Windows 11 from scratch, because of all the remaining detritus left after performing the above steps. And uninstalling SupportAssist caused some instability and weird errors upon login. - Uninstall all the bloatware apps the come installed with Windows 11 again. - Remove the trial offers from the Start menu. - Remove the third-party stub apps from the Start menu (eg. TikTok). - Remove the O365 stub apps. Compared to on my Mac: - Remove apps from the Dock - Go into /Applications and uninstall about 6 Apple apps I don't use.
- TacticalCoder 10mo ago
  > Here's some of the stuff I had to do on my new Dell, from memory: Or, you know, just format the disk and install Linux.
  - runjake 10mo ago
    If it were my choice…
    - wltr 10mo ago
      How is it you could reinstall Windows, but not Linux? Or is it just mandatory to run Windows, but nobody cares if you reinstall it? My wife’s Windows laptop won’t allow me to even run Logitech Connect Utility, to reconnect some devices (pair a keyboard to the mouse). It surely won’t allow the full reinstall, it’s locked entirely. Hence, I’m curious what’s up with your work (I assume) laptop.
      - runjake 10mo ago

mlrtime 10mo ago

It's time to buy a new phone then! Surely that new phone won't feel so bloated, rinse and repeat.