4 ms·

Haven't read the paper but the mention of IIT rubs me the wrong way.. maybe it had the opposite effect for GP? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integrated_informa

Haven't read the paper but the mention of IIT rubs me the wrong way.. maybe it had the opposite effect for GP? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integrated_information_theory https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integrated_information_theory OTOH if you have a quick defence of IIT, I will reconsider

PaulHoule 10mo ago
YOShInOn gave me three choices for this article including (2) https://phys.org/news/2025-11-species-consciousness-conscious.html https://phys.org/news/2025-11-species-consciousness-consciou... and (3) https://royalsocietypublishing.org/rstb/article/380/1939/20240314/235161/Three-types-of-phenomenal-consciousness-and-their https://royalsocietypublishing.org/rstb/article/380/1939/202... of which I thought the one I posted (1) fit my intuitive model that we don't give animals enough credit for their mental faculties of which I'd say that generically birds and mammals are probably capable of just about everything we are except for language in the Chomsky sense if not the Saussure sense. (2) is crammed with obnxious ads and is suppressed by a quota of articles from that site that I enforce, I liked the intellectual framework behind (3) a lot. So (2) vs (3) was a tough call for me, I can punch in a manual override to post either one of them or both.
- gsf_emergency_6 10mo ago
  https://royalsocietypublishing.org/rstb/article/380/1939/20240314/235161/Three-types-of-phenomenal-consciousness-and-their https://royalsocietypublishing.org/rstb/article/380/1939/202... It is mainly the ability of having and integrating meta-representations that boosts the function of general alertness, such that it enables new abilities like explicit self-involving and future-directed learning and decision-making Seems to be more direct the phys org didn't do a good job of summarizing their ALARM theory Ok a better question is your how your 3 boxes map to macrosocial obj relations. What is the macrosocial version of the "real self" Is it the ideal gov? Actual gov? Laws that are effectively enforced?
  - PaulHoule 10mo ago
    The "real self" is what Engels it talking about in terms of "from each according to his abilities (which spring from the real self) and to each according to his needs (likewise)". The system of "false self" + "symptomatic self" is a broken ego, that system which mediates between undeveloped potential and unreasonable desires and what can actually be accomplished the world. The ideal social organization gets the most out of people's ability and satisfies their needs. It also gives people some sense of cohesion and being part of a whole [1] I've been taking everything ego-dystonic out of myself and my environment, particularly I put the three parts of the card I tore back together on the wall. [2] [1] I am an American, I am a human, an animal, a resident of Spaceship Earth, a representative o [2] I made that card during the crisis of 2021 to remind myself of the dangers of my "evil twin" but now my label for that is "2021" as I had to re-assimilate him to be whole.
    - aebtebeten 10mo ago
      3 boxes? Sorry, my Algolia-fu is weak... my view of consciousness is orthogonal to TFA: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23475069 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23475069 bitrotted link: https://www.temerex.com/Games/MindRead/Shannon.pdf https://www.temerex.com/Games/MindRead/Shannon.pdf

PaulHoule 10mo ago

YOShInOn gave me three choices for this article including (2) https://phys.org/news/2025-11-species-consciousness-conscious.html https://phys.org/news/2025-11-species-consciousness-consciou... and (3) https://royalsocietypublishing.org/rstb/article/380/1939/20240314/235161/Three-types-of-phenomenal-consciousness-and-their https://royalsocietypublishing.org/rstb/article/380/1939/202... of which I thought the one I posted (1) fit my intuitive model that we don't give animals enough credit for their mental faculties of which I'd say that generically birds and mammals are probably capable of just about everything we are except for language in the Chomsky sense if not the Saussure sense. (2) is crammed with obnxious ads and is suppressed by a quota of articles from that site that I enforce, I liked the intellectual framework behind (3) a lot. So (2) vs (3) was a tough call for me, I can punch in a manual override to post either one of them or both.

gsf_emergency_6 10mo ago
https://royalsocietypublishing.org/rstb/article/380/1939/20240314/235161/Three-types-of-phenomenal-consciousness-and-their https://royalsocietypublishing.org/rstb/article/380/1939/202... It is mainly the ability of having and integrating meta-representations that boosts the function of general alertness, such that it enables new abilities like explicit self-involving and future-directed learning and decision-making Seems to be more direct the phys org didn't do a good job of summarizing their ALARM theory Ok a better question is your how your 3 boxes map to macrosocial obj relations. What is the macrosocial version of the "real self" Is it the ideal gov? Actual gov? Laws that are effectively enforced?
- PaulHoule 10mo ago
  The "real self" is what Engels it talking about in terms of "from each according to his abilities (which spring from the real self) and to each according to his needs (likewise)". The system of "false self" + "symptomatic self" is a broken ego, that system which mediates between undeveloped potential and unreasonable desires and what can actually be accomplished the world. The ideal social organization gets the most out of people's ability and satisfies their needs. It also gives people some sense of cohesion and being part of a whole [1] I've been taking everything ego-dystonic out of myself and my environment, particularly I put the three parts of the card I tore back together on the wall. [2] [1] I am an American, I am a human, an animal, a resident of Spaceship Earth, a representative o [2] I made that card during the crisis of 2021 to remind myself of the dangers of my "evil twin" but now my label for that is "2021" as I had to re-assimilate him to be whole.
  - aebtebeten 10mo ago
    3 boxes? Sorry, my Algolia-fu is weak... my view of consciousness is orthogonal to TFA: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23475069 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23475069 bitrotted link: https://www.temerex.com/Games/MindRead/Shannon.pdf https://www.temerex.com/Games/MindRead/Shannon.pdf