4 ms·

afaik that's +VAT and also for LIRs only. LIRs apply markup, see https://www.lir.services/lir-sponsoring/ https://www.lir.services/lir-sponsoring/ they charge 2

by rmoriz 10mo ago

afaik that's +VAT and also for LIRs only. LIRs apply markup, see https://www.lir.services/lir-sponsoring/ https://www.lir.services/lir-sponsoring/ they charge 200€ per resource, so ASN + PI would be at last 400€/year that's way above the price of ARIN and you have a middleman. You must have a sponsoring LIR for your resources or become a LIR yourself. The only exception is LEGACY resources (IPv4, no ASN) but that's a different story.

icedchai 10mo ago
There are more competitive LIRs out there. Example: https://lagrange.cloud/products/lir https://lagrange.cloud/products/lir It’s also cheaper for me because I have legacy ARIN space. All I really needed was an ASN. The LIR gives me some PA v6 space for cheap, too.
- rmoriz 10mo ago
  Okay, but that is not enough to operate independently. PA v6 is another dependency. With ARIN you get your personal IPv6 assignment.
  - icedchai 10mo ago
    For a hobbyist, the difference is academic. You can announce PA space with your own ASN, which is what I do. If I change LIRs I’ll have to renumber my IPv6 space.
    - rmoriz 10mo ago
      Companies offering LIR services to hobbyists are probably not going to stay in business forever, as many of them are 1 person companies, too. Also keep in mind that they may change pricing. I understand, that with IPv6 the numbering strategy is almost always automatic and a renumbering can be done in a couple of hours, but it's still an inconvenience, especially when you have to update a lot of AAAA records. I really think that when you start to operate an AS that you should have a direct RIR membership. And as mentioned above, RIPE has a higher financial entry barrier. I remember they had an object volume based pricing scheme 15 years ago, just like ARIN still has.
      - icedchai 10mo ago
        None of us know what will happen in the future. All I can say is that currently, it is cheaper for a hobbyist to use a RIPE LIR than to use ARIN. If this changes in the future, I'll move to ARIN. ARIN is lowering their costs gradually. When I first made the RIPE LIR or ARIN decision several years ago, ARIN wanted $500 just to register an ASN, on top of the yearly fees. I see they have removed that requirement.

by rmoriz 10mo ago

icedchai 10mo ago

There are more competitive LIRs out there. Example: https://lagrange.cloud/products/lir https://lagrange.cloud/products/lir It’s also cheaper for me because I have legacy ARIN space. All I really needed was an ASN. The LIR gives me some PA v6 space for cheap, too.

rmoriz 10mo ago
Okay, but that is not enough to operate independently. PA v6 is another dependency. With ARIN you get your personal IPv6 assignment.
- icedchai 10mo ago
  For a hobbyist, the difference is academic. You can announce PA space with your own ASN, which is what I do. If I change LIRs I’ll have to renumber my IPv6 space.
  - rmoriz 10mo ago
    Companies offering LIR services to hobbyists are probably not going to stay in business forever, as many of them are 1 person companies, too. Also keep in mind that they may change pricing. I understand, that with IPv6 the numbering strategy is almost always automatic and a renumbering can be done in a couple of hours, but it's still an inconvenience, especially when you have to update a lot of AAAA records. I really think that when you start to operate an AS that you should have a direct RIR membership. And as mentioned above, RIPE has a higher financial entry barrier. I remember they had an object volume based pricing scheme 15 years ago, just like ARIN still has.
    - icedchai 10mo ago
      None of us know what will happen in the future. All I can say is that currently, it is cheaper for a hobbyist to use a RIPE LIR than to use ARIN. If this changes in the future, I'll move to ARIN. ARIN is lowering their costs gradually. When I first made the RIPE LIR or ARIN decision several years ago, ARIN wanted $500 just to register an ASN, on top of the yearly fees. I see they have removed that requirement.