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I hate the current trend in histrionic social media. A ‘banned book’ is one that you are not allowed to own by the State. You face fines, detention, interrogati
by riazrizvi 10mo ago
I hate the current trend in histrionic social media. A ‘banned book’ is one that you are not allowed to own by the State. You face fines, detention, interrogation, prison, torture, execution. Examples are 1984, The Satanic Verses. Countries that maintain book bans are Iran, China, Russia, North Korea, Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan.
Your school not stocking books you want is not a ban. It’s the prerogative of the institution to choose how it shapes minds. It cannot avoid taking on some angle, since any incomplete collection is an editorial choice.
- jfindper 10mo ago>A ‘banned book’ is one that you are not allowed to own by the State. >Your school not stocking books you want is not a ban. It’s the prerogative of the institution to choose how it shapes minds. At least some of these books are banned from schools by state-level law, not because the school district chose to not stock it.
- m00x 10mo agoWhich books and which law? Aren't there other books that are banned for legitimate reasons like hate speech and racial hate that aren't included here?
- macintux 10mo agoFlorida bill 1069 allows parents to challenge the inclusion of books in the library, but only explicitly identifies books related to sexual preferences/conduct/etc. https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2023/1069/BillText/er/PDF https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2023/1069/BillText/er/... The bill is all about pronouns, heterosexuality, abstinence, and getting books out of libraries on those grounds.
- m00x 10mo agoInclusion != ban. A ban would be you'd get in trouble for having the book in your possession, which isn't the case here.
- jfindper 10mo ago>Which books and which law? The one I was referring to: https://www.sltrib.com/news/education/2024/08/02/utah-book-ban-list-these-titles/ https://www.sltrib.com/news/education/2024/08/02/utah-book-b... "The law, which went into effect July 1, requires that a book be removed from all public schools in the state if at least three school districts (or at least two school districts and five charter schools) determine it amounts to “objective sensitive material”" It seems like there may be more similar laws, per sibling comment. >Aren't there other books that are banned for legitimate reasons like hate speech and racial hate that aren't included here? I don't know, and I'm not sure how it is related to my comment. I did not create the list in the article and I don't maintain any other list of banned books.
- m00x 10mo agoThis says it's a removal from the library, not a ban. You can have it with you, but it won't be available in the school library. Would you want your kids reading Mein Kampf or The Passing of the Great Race? I wouldn't.
- jfindper 10mo ago>You can have it with you, but it won't be available in the school library. No, they are "prohibited in the school setting". You cannot bring it with you.
- giraffe_lady 10mo agoWhat should we call it when you may know of a specific book but be unable to access it through any path available to you? Banned makes sense to me as shorthand though sure it's not quite exactly accurate. Suggest me an alternative? EDIT: This was a sincere and I thought pretty neutral question but I have clearly touched a nerve with this. Everyone seems to be having a great time.
- Levitz 10mo agoNon-stocked by schools? That's literally what is happening. Prevented to be stocked? Library removed? What should we call it when you can legally acquire the book, read and share it with other people with no concern from the law or authorities whatsoever? Do you think the correct word for this is "banned"?
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- like_any_other 10mo agoWe have, broadly speaking, two groups deciding which books to make available to children using taxpayer money - the voters/parents/elected officials, and unelected librarians. If one of those groups decides to withhold a book from schoolchildren, it's fine and not a ban. But if another does the same, then it's a ban. Or am I completely wrong, and Jared Taylor's "White Identity" is available in every school library, explaining its absence from "banned" book lists?
- drcongo 10mo agoYou are wilfully wrong.
- like_any_other 10mo agoSo Jared Taylor's "White Identity" is available in most school libraries?
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- amanaplanacanal 10mo agoThis is not a case of a school or librarian choosing books. This is a case of some external party forcing them to remove books.
- School-Cotton 10mo agoThe state is not an "external party" to a school. Schools are run by the state; they are not sovereign or independent entities empowered to make their own decisions.
- IAmBroom 10mo agoAnd the state is a function of the voting electorate, so by your logic anyone who casts a vote is effectively a school supervisor... yet some of them are mysteriously forbidden from stepping foot on school property.
- m00x 10mo agoCan you back this up with a source?
- macintux 10mo agohttps://www.metroweekly.com/2024/06/an-idaho-library-goes-adults-only-will-no-longer-admit-minors/ https://www.metroweekly.com/2024/06/an-idaho-library-goes-ad...
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- tencentshill 10mo agoLibrarians and schools have always been able to curate their collections as they see fit. The issue here is the state is now getting directly involved which has very little precedent since the Red Scare.
- riazrizvi 10mo agoOh I see now. You are describing the ongoing laws which restrict minors from viewing certain content. You are calling this ‘book banning’. Yeah, no.
- Amezarak 10mo agoLibrarians culling collections by any arbitrary criteria = good, fine. (We even have examples of all books prior to 2000 being mass deleted!) Parents (customers) lobbying school administrators about what should be in the school library = bad, evil.
- MalikTerm 10mo agoI thought the countries you listed as maintaining book bans was a little short, given that basically every Western/First World/Global North country has previously banned or continues to ban books. For instance, Belgium, Finland, France, The Netherlands, Norway, Poland, South Korea, and the United States have all banned the sale and publication of books within recent memory, with restrictions on the importation of books and potential detention and fines for people importing them, and there may have been legal challenges made to the authors and publishers of books. The definition you gave for banning books does narrow it down a bit though. Restriction on the publication, sale, or importation isn't a ban, but possession is. Ah. I guess a book is only banned if you face legal consequences for owning it after purchase during the very limited window that it may appear on bookshelves. In that case, I can't say for certain that Australia, Canada, Germany, and New Zealand bans books, but I can say that I would not want to be in possession of certain types of books in these countries. The definition of 'banned books' gets a little murky here though, is the inevitable police detention and interrogation due to the possession of the books themselves or rather obscenity/hate speech/Nazism/terrorism/drug laws? Does it count if the detention and interrogation occurs after an unrelated search of your property? Is a book only banned if it is confiscated from your possession? Does it count if you win your court case? Which leaves the only Western nations that fit such a definition as being Austria and the United Kingdom, which do objectively criminalise the possession of banned books.