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Great advice if you don’t need a smartphone. Many do, they are now an identity tool. The alternative to Apple is…Google? How is that in any way better other

by kmbfjr 10mo ago

Great advice if you don’t need a smartphone. Many do, they are now an identity tool. The alternative to Apple is…Google? How is that in any way better other than not being Apple? Sure, there are de-Googlefied versions of Android and today they work . But Google is actively working on ending the ability of those alternative operating systems to work.

mistercheph 10mo ago
just curious, where do you have to use a smartphone?
- rvnx 10mo ago
  Banks 2FA are not SMS anymore, so no banking, and because no 2FA no online card payments and no limit adjustment. Some banks are even app-only. IRL events where you have to open the app at the gate. Probably no charging for your EV. No bus tickets. No Uber. No scooters. No food delivery. More tedious flying / immigration. No Tinder (requires live face verification on your phone) Some modern cars you are going to have troubles. Impossible to setup a lot of smart appliances (like home WiFi routers). Many examples. It’s like: can you live without a bank card ? Probably but not everywhere and you will not be able to go to all shops. Essentially it’s great if you plan to stay at home. Becomes a great problem once you want to interact with anyone further than 1 meter from you.
  - smakt 10mo ago
    None of those require smartphones if you live in a free country (1) (2). (1) Unbanked population in Uganda or india don't have options. Funnily, it's become the same with everyone, banked or unbanked, in the USA. The USA a third world dictatorship now, so expect that and more. Please vote for the orange buffoon a third time! He will most surely try to get on a third term. (2) No bank in the EU requires a smartphone; it's banned by law (you know, law that protects people, the type you lost). "Banks" that are app-only are not banks but financial casinos. No bus driver in the EU can refuse small coins. In some countries they cannot refuse that you get on the bus without paying. No shop in the EU can refuse cash. No EV charging requires any app; you can pay right at the charging station with a credit card. Uber is not a universal right but a trinket. Same with tinder/food delivery and all the impoverishing tech for the disowned. Enjoy the USA.
    - swiftcoder 10mo ago
      > No bank in the EU requires a smartphone They may not require one, but good luck getting transactions done without one. My EU bank branches are now only open 3 hours a day, and to approve an online transaction without the app means phoning the bank during business hours…
      - smakt 10mo ago
        >good luck getting transactions done without one you mean like I do all the time with my high-tech plastic code card? At any time of day or night, workday or weekend? I must be lucky because I have been doing it for decades. Your mistake was telling them you agree to use their app in your insecure smartphone. You were not obligated to do so.
        swiftcoder 10mo ago
        > Your mistake was telling them you agree to use their app in your insecure smartphone. You were not obligated to do so. Must be nice to have such choice. In rural areas you generally only have one bank in the local area, and unless you want to drive an hour to the city to do your banking, them's the breaks
        smakt 10mo ago
        >In rural areas you generally only have one bank in the local area I agree to that but I don't follow. Are you a resident of a EU country? If yes, any bank operating in that country is obligated to let you open an account with them. Notice I say "resident", wich is a lower bar than "national". Banks operating in the boondocks and banks operating in the most expensive high street of the capital city, all must give you an account if you ask, so I don't follow unless they make you do banking in person only at one office, which I don't think is the case.
      - dariosalvi78 10mo ago
        many banks have alternative methods in addition to the app, typically hardware keys or OTP devices. Also, many banks allow loading apps on non-Google Androids like in this list: https://community.e.foundation/t/list-banking-apps-on-e-os/33091 https://community.e.foundation/t/list-banking-apps-on-e-os/3... there is life outside Google/Apple, and we should support it.
  - baq 10mo ago
    > Some banks are even app-only. Expect this to be the norm going forward due to hardware attestation being normalized on phones.
- nullfield 10mo ago
  The US has just proposed making the ESTA application process mobile-only. As an example of one. Banks requiring device attestation may be a pain in the ass, but it’s not a “requirement”; they (for now) still have websites and, usually, a physical branch. Other examples probably exist.
dotancohen 10mo ago
In my country we have a large religious population that eschews smartphones. Thanks to this, all services - bank, government, etc - are available without requiring apps or even internet access.

by kmbfjr 10mo ago

mistercheph 10mo ago

just curious, where do you have to use a smartphone?

rvnx 10mo ago
Banks 2FA are not SMS anymore, so no banking, and because no 2FA no online card payments and no limit adjustment. Some banks are even app-only. IRL events where you have to open the app at the gate. Probably no charging for your EV. No bus tickets. No Uber. No scooters. No food delivery. More tedious flying / immigration. No Tinder (requires live face verification on your phone) Some modern cars you are going to have troubles. Impossible to setup a lot of smart appliances (like home WiFi routers). Many examples. It’s like: can you live without a bank card ? Probably but not everywhere and you will not be able to go to all shops. Essentially it’s great if you plan to stay at home. Becomes a great problem once you want to interact with anyone further than 1 meter from you.
- smakt 10mo ago
  None of those require smartphones if you live in a free country (1) (2). (1) Unbanked population in Uganda or india don't have options. Funnily, it's become the same with everyone, banked or unbanked, in the USA. The USA a third world dictatorship now, so expect that and more. Please vote for the orange buffoon a third time! He will most surely try to get on a third term. (2) No bank in the EU requires a smartphone; it's banned by law (you know, law that protects people, the type you lost). "Banks" that are app-only are not banks but financial casinos. No bus driver in the EU can refuse small coins. In some countries they cannot refuse that you get on the bus without paying. No shop in the EU can refuse cash. No EV charging requires any app; you can pay right at the charging station with a credit card. Uber is not a universal right but a trinket. Same with tinder/food delivery and all the impoverishing tech for the disowned. Enjoy the USA.
  - swiftcoder 10mo ago
    > No bank in the EU requires a smartphone They may not require one, but good luck getting transactions done without one. My EU bank branches are now only open 3 hours a day, and to approve an online transaction without the app means phoning the bank during business hours…
    - smakt 10mo ago
      >good luck getting transactions done without one you mean like I do all the time with my high-tech plastic code card? At any time of day or night, workday or weekend? I must be lucky because I have been doing it for decades. Your mistake was telling them you agree to use their app in your insecure smartphone. You were not obligated to do so.
      - swiftcoder 10mo ago
        > Your mistake was telling them you agree to use their app in your insecure smartphone. You were not obligated to do so. Must be nice to have such choice. In rural areas you generally only have one bank in the local area, and unless you want to drive an hour to the city to do your banking, them's the breaks
        smakt 10mo ago
        >In rural areas you generally only have one bank in the local area I agree to that but I don't follow. Are you a resident of a EU country? If yes, any bank operating in that country is obligated to let you open an account with them. Notice I say "resident", wich is a lower bar than "national". Banks operating in the boondocks and banks operating in the most expensive high street of the capital city, all must give you an account if you ask, so I don't follow unless they make you do banking in person only at one office, which I don't think is the case.
    - dariosalvi78 10mo ago
      many banks have alternative methods in addition to the app, typically hardware keys or OTP devices. Also, many banks allow loading apps on non-Google Androids like in this list: https://community.e.foundation/t/list-banking-apps-on-e-os/33091 https://community.e.foundation/t/list-banking-apps-on-e-os/3... there is life outside Google/Apple, and we should support it.
- baq 10mo ago
  > Some banks are even app-only. Expect this to be the norm going forward due to hardware attestation being normalized on phones.
nullfield 10mo ago
The US has just proposed making the ESTA application process mobile-only. As an example of one. Banks requiring device attestation may be a pain in the ass, but it’s not a “requirement”; they (for now) still have websites and, usually, a physical branch. Other examples probably exist.

dotancohen 10mo ago

In my country we have a large religious population that eschews smartphones. Thanks to this, all services - bank, government, etc - are available without requiring apps or even internet access.