5 ms·

> It's basically a linux computer with a huge screen Why would I want a Linux computer with a huge screen? I just want a huge screen. I’ll provide my own con

by jader201 10mo ago

> It's basically a linux computer with a huge screen Why would I want a Linux computer with a huge screen? I just want a huge screen. I’ll provide my own connected devices, independent of the screen.

Underphil 10mo ago
Yeah, I'd absolutely agree here. The article didn't "miss" this option. It just isn't relevant here.
stravant 10mo ago
Why wouldn't you want it to be a computer? Then it can be connected to your devices AND also do the job itself in a situation where it's awkward to connect to a device. If already needs a computer in it to drive menus / modern display protocols. Having that computer be powerful enough to also decode content is barely an extra cost.
- fulafel 10mo ago
  A rooted piece of trashy IOT is trashy IOT. It's an acquired taste, the excitement of putting a black box insecure linux device on the home network to add to your home infra admin duties.
  - pessimizer 10mo ago
    A rooted computer is the opposite of a black box. This makes no sense.
    - fulafel 10mo ago
      Rooting gets you additional means to reverse engineer the proprietary software system but doesn't automagically lighten the box. It's all relative of course, maybe you view anything you can Ghidra as not-black-box. (though this is kind of tangential to rooting - for a many/most devices you can get a hold of the blobs to reverse engineer without rooting anything)
  - olyjohn 10mo ago
    If someone can get access to the TV on your local network, you're already in trouble.
- wiether 10mo ago
  For the same reason I don't want a self-heating mug.
  - michaelsalim 10mo ago
    Why wouldn't you want that? Genuinely curious
    - boerseth 10mo ago
      Modularity and separation of concerns can extend into other domains than software. For me, it seems so much simpler to keep the two separate. You won't be forced to wash the heating element every time you wash the cup. Can't heat a different cup while the other is in the dishwasher, unless all your cups are self-heating. Normally, the only way for a cup to break is if it shatters, but with an inbuilt heater there's electronics that can break too. And should the cup shatter, now the heater is unusable too, or vice versa.
      - wiether 10mo ago
        Exactly! I have to have a kettle for other purpose (including heating water for other mugs than mine), and no self-heating mug is going to be as efficient as a kettle to heat water. Furthermore, I also put cold or room temperature liquids in my mug. With a self-heating one, I would be carrying the heating parts for absolutely no reason. Same goes for a TV. By keeping things separated, I can decide what I do which each device and manage their lifecycle separately. If the device reading video files is included in the TV, I can't plug it to another TV or a projector or even take it with me to use it elsewhere. While I've upgraded three times my video playing device to follow tech evolution, I've kept the same TV to plug them in.
        saalweachter 10mo ago
        But like, a coffeemaker is a thing. You can make coffee with a kettle, but if you are making enough coffee often enough, it does make sense to bundle a second kettle into a dedicated coffeemaker, even if you are reducing the functionality of it by doing so.
- Itoldmyselfso 10mo ago
  How about the abdysmal security Smart TVs either have right of the shelf or for certain after they are no longer kept up-to-date? I don't want to worry having my TV act either as botnet or spying device (many come with microphones and cameras nowadays). I rather purchase additional device that has decent security that I can attach to the TV if I need to.
- lenkite 10mo ago
  > Why wouldn't you want it to be a computer? Because I can then easily upgrade my computer without upgrading my TV.
  - pessimizer 10mo ago
    Do you have to upgrade your computer when you upgrade your router? This entire subthread is not computer-literate. Your monitor contains a computer. A dumb display contains a computer. Your keyboard contains a computer. You can strip the software down on them so they do nothing but take commands and drive whatever electronics you have attached to them, but it will still be software on a computer. If there's a lot of RAM and a fat processor, like on a rooted smart TV, I might (but not necessarily) make it do a little more than that.
- ryandrake 10mo ago
  > Why wouldn't you want it to be a computer? The same reason I don't want anything else in my life to be a computer. A computer is one more component that can fail and take down the whole product. I want my computer to be a computer and that's it.
taxmeifyoucan 10mo ago
I feel you, that's exactly why I was using only monitors before! I got convinced to go for this as an acceptable compromise with much more control than some proprietary backend.
- zeristor 10mo ago
  Begs the question, how long before smart monitors.
  - shantara 10mo ago
    Unfortunately, they already exist - the M-series smart monitors, made by Samsung (who else?). They made a splash a few months ago when they started showing popups over people’s screen content nagging them to update or register for some service during the normal monitor-like usage
ranguna 10mo ago
Well, you can make it a PC and then turn it off, I guess. Then let the rest of us have all the fun.
- jader201 10mo ago
  It sounds like you still want a smart TV, just with control. Which is fine. But for many people, we just want a monitor, maybe with speakers (I personally am fine also separating this). I prefer separation of concerns — if I want to attach a computer to my TV, I’ll do that as a search device. Why have a dependency on the TV hardware, when I can attach upgradable parts?
  - pessimizer 10mo ago
    A monitor has a processor in it that is running an OS and software. These are digital devices. The nit you're picking is silly. If you want to buy a bare LCD panel, they're cheap. But you're going to have to add a processor to it that runs an OS (which you're free to write yourself, along with the driver) in order for it to understand any input. All that slapped together is what we call a monitor, or a television. If you want an analog television, they'll pay you to haul it off from wherever you see it, but you're going to have to add an external computer to it in order to process the digital information that you want to display into waveforms that you can push over coaxial cables. Not wanting a "smart tv" means people don't want a smartphone for a television, an OS that they don't have any control over. If you want to make up another definition, you're going to have to set limits to acceptable RAM, clock speed, number of processors, and I don't know why you would waste your time doing that. The number, however, will never be zero for any of these things.
    - ssl-3 10mo ago
      It's not necessary for a display to have an operating system. They make fixed-function chips in factories every day that do stuff like convert video signals from one format to another (including formats that LCD panels can deal with). Like the TFP401. For illustration, here is one on a board, ready to plug into an LCD panel and use for whatever: https://www.adafruit.com/product/2218 https://www.adafruit.com/product/2218 It doesn't run an OS. It's barely even programmable, and the programmability it does have relates only to configuring pre-defined hardware functions. It doesn't have an instruction set. It can't add 1+1. But it can bridge the gap between a consumer device that produces video and a fairly bare LCD panel. It's a very much a single-tasker. (Do any of the current crop of consumer-oriented televisions and computer monitors use this kind of simple pathway? Most assuredly not, which is the complaint that brought us here to begin with. But these pathways exist anyway. It's completely possible to to create an entire video display and house it in a nice-looking package, put it in a retail box, and sell it on store shelves without involving an operating system. It's not a technological limitation.)

Underphil 10mo ago

Yeah, I'd absolutely agree here. The article didn't "miss" this option. It just isn't relevant here.

stravant 10mo ago

Why wouldn't you want it to be a computer? Then it can be connected to your devices AND also do the job itself in a situation where it's awkward to connect to a device. If already needs a computer in it to drive menus / modern display protocols. Having that computer be powerful enough to also decode content is barely an extra cost.

fulafel 10mo ago
A rooted piece of trashy IOT is trashy IOT. It's an acquired taste, the excitement of putting a black box insecure linux device on the home network to add to your home infra admin duties.
- pessimizer 10mo ago
  A rooted computer is the opposite of a black box. This makes no sense.
  - fulafel 10mo ago
    Rooting gets you additional means to reverse engineer the proprietary software system but doesn't automagically lighten the box. It's all relative of course, maybe you view anything you can Ghidra as not-black-box. (though this is kind of tangential to rooting - for a many/most devices you can get a hold of the blobs to reverse engineer without rooting anything)
- olyjohn 10mo ago
  If someone can get access to the TV on your local network, you're already in trouble.
wiether 10mo ago
For the same reason I don't want a self-heating mug.
- michaelsalim 10mo ago
  Why wouldn't you want that? Genuinely curious
  - boerseth 10mo ago
    Modularity and separation of concerns can extend into other domains than software. For me, it seems so much simpler to keep the two separate. You won't be forced to wash the heating element every time you wash the cup. Can't heat a different cup while the other is in the dishwasher, unless all your cups are self-heating. Normally, the only way for a cup to break is if it shatters, but with an inbuilt heater there's electronics that can break too. And should the cup shatter, now the heater is unusable too, or vice versa.
    - wiether 10mo ago
      Exactly! I have to have a kettle for other purpose (including heating water for other mugs than mine), and no self-heating mug is going to be as efficient as a kettle to heat water. Furthermore, I also put cold or room temperature liquids in my mug. With a self-heating one, I would be carrying the heating parts for absolutely no reason. Same goes for a TV. By keeping things separated, I can decide what I do which each device and manage their lifecycle separately. If the device reading video files is included in the TV, I can't plug it to another TV or a projector or even take it with me to use it elsewhere. While I've upgraded three times my video playing device to follow tech evolution, I've kept the same TV to plug them in.
      - saalweachter 10mo ago
        But like, a coffeemaker is a thing. You can make coffee with a kettle, but if you are making enough coffee often enough, it does make sense to bundle a second kettle into a dedicated coffeemaker, even if you are reducing the functionality of it by doing so.
Itoldmyselfso 10mo ago
How about the abdysmal security Smart TVs either have right of the shelf or for certain after they are no longer kept up-to-date? I don't want to worry having my TV act either as botnet or spying device (many come with microphones and cameras nowadays). I rather purchase additional device that has decent security that I can attach to the TV if I need to.
lenkite 10mo ago
> Why wouldn't you want it to be a computer? Because I can then easily upgrade my computer without upgrading my TV.
- pessimizer 10mo ago
  Do you have to upgrade your computer when you upgrade your router? This entire subthread is not computer-literate. Your monitor contains a computer. A dumb display contains a computer. Your keyboard contains a computer. You can strip the software down on them so they do nothing but take commands and drive whatever electronics you have attached to them, but it will still be software on a computer. If there's a lot of RAM and a fat processor, like on a rooted smart TV, I might (but not necessarily) make it do a little more than that.
ryandrake 10mo ago
> Why wouldn't you want it to be a computer? The same reason I don't want anything else in my life to be a computer. A computer is one more component that can fail and take down the whole product. I want my computer to be a computer and that's it.

taxmeifyoucan 10mo ago

I feel you, that's exactly why I was using only monitors before! I got convinced to go for this as an acceptable compromise with much more control than some proprietary backend.

zeristor 10mo ago
Begs the question, how long before smart monitors.
- shantara 10mo ago
  Unfortunately, they already exist - the M-series smart monitors, made by Samsung (who else?). They made a splash a few months ago when they started showing popups over people’s screen content nagging them to update or register for some service during the normal monitor-like usage

ranguna 10mo ago

Well, you can make it a PC and then turn it off, I guess. Then let the rest of us have all the fun.

jader201 10mo ago
It sounds like you still want a smart TV, just with control. Which is fine. But for many people, we just want a monitor, maybe with speakers (I personally am fine also separating this). I prefer separation of concerns — if I want to attach a computer to my TV, I’ll do that as a search device. Why have a dependency on the TV hardware, when I can attach upgradable parts?
- pessimizer 10mo ago
  A monitor has a processor in it that is running an OS and software. These are digital devices. The nit you're picking is silly. If you want to buy a bare LCD panel, they're cheap. But you're going to have to add a processor to it that runs an OS (which you're free to write yourself, along with the driver) in order for it to understand any input. All that slapped together is what we call a monitor, or a television. If you want an analog television, they'll pay you to haul it off from wherever you see it, but you're going to have to add an external computer to it in order to process the digital information that you want to display into waveforms that you can push over coaxial cables. Not wanting a "smart tv" means people don't want a smartphone for a television, an OS that they don't have any control over. If you want to make up another definition, you're going to have to set limits to acceptable RAM, clock speed, number of processors, and I don't know why you would waste your time doing that. The number, however, will never be zero for any of these things.
  - ssl-3 10mo ago
    It's not necessary for a display to have an operating system. They make fixed-function chips in factories every day that do stuff like convert video signals from one format to another (including formats that LCD panels can deal with). Like the TFP401. For illustration, here is one on a board, ready to plug into an LCD panel and use for whatever: https://www.adafruit.com/product/2218 https://www.adafruit.com/product/2218 It doesn't run an OS. It's barely even programmable, and the programmability it does have relates only to configuring pre-defined hardware functions. It doesn't have an instruction set. It can't add 1+1. But it can bridge the gap between a consumer device that produces video and a fairly bare LCD panel. It's a very much a single-tasker. (Do any of the current crop of consumer-oriented televisions and computer monitors use this kind of simple pathway? Most assuredly not, which is the complaint that brought us here to begin with. But these pathways exist anyway. It's completely possible to to create an entire video display and house it in a nice-looking package, put it in a retail box, and sell it on store shelves without involving an operating system. It's not a technological limitation.)