4 ms·
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by impossiblefork 10mo ago
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- cramsession 10mo ago“Expected” is not enough. These bombs didn’t go off in active war zone. They went off in public in Lebanon, and maimed and killed civilians.
- impossiblefork 10mo agoI found this thesis from some guy doing a master in international operation law at the Swedish defence college, https://fhs.diva-portal.org/smash/get/diva2:1974147/FULLTEXT01.pdf https://fhs.diva-portal.org/smash/get/diva2:1974147/FULLTEXT... and I interpret his analysis as that it was targeted enough to be legal.
- dlubarov 10mo agoThe principle of proportionality is explicitly about expectations, i.e. expected military advantage vs expected collateral damage. You seem to be holding Israel to an impossible standard of guaranteeing zero collateral damage, which IHL does not require because no military is capable of that.
- UltraSane 10mo agoHezbollah was actively launching thousands of missiles at Israel when these pagers blew up. They stopped launching missiles at Israel en masse soon after these pagers blew up. What a odd coincidence.
- kamikazeturtles 10mo agoMany of the people who had the pagers were doctors, lawyers, bureaucrats... Maybe I'm wrong, but, I think Hezb0-lla-h is pretty much the "government", especially in southern Lebanon
- oldandboring 10mo ago[flagged]
- cmavvv 10mo agoThat's like planting a bomb in front of a military camp. You might have a target, but in the end you just kill whoever was nearby at that time. In the case of the pager attack, that includes children aged 11 and 12, as well as a nurse. That's much closer to a terrorist attack than to legal warfare.
- impossiblefork 10mo agoYes, but planting a bomb in front of a military camp is absolutely legal.
- simonsarris 10mo ago"planting a bomb in front of a military camp" is like the textbook goal for bomb-planting devices (airplanes, artillery, MRLs), its one of the most normal scenarios out of all of normal war scenarios. Planting a bomb on each soldier would be even better.
- nicce 10mo agoYou cannot quarantee who is holding the pager at the moment of explosion.
- UltraSane 10mo agoYou can have a reasonable expectation secure military pagers are only going to be used by soldiers. Given how few collateral deaths there were this was a reasonable assumption.
- lucideer 10mo agoThere might be some potential legal defense in terms of proportionality of collateral damage but it's so thin here as to be absurd. Regardless, given the number of war crimes this army has been found guilty of, this is somewhat moot. What's another war crime in the grand scheme of things.
- tguvot 10mo agothere is 0 war crimes that IDF has been found guilty of by any legal authority.
- lucideer 10mo agoThere's no central enforcement of international war crime law, so this thread on legal technicalities isn't particularly relevant in real terms, but there is at least an arrest warrant out for the (former) Minister for Defence & Prime Minister in 124 countries, so there's not a lot of room for ambiguity here.
- tguvot 10mo agoso you agree that nobody in IDF was found guilty of war crimes ? been accused it's not same as been found guilty. at least last time I checked.
- oldandboring 10mo ago[flagged]