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> I call it a "bullshit generator" because it generates output "with indifference to the truth". Seems unnecessary harsh. ChatGPT is a useful tool even if limi

by eatitraw 10mo ago

> I call it a "bullshit generator" because it generates output "with indifference to the truth". Seems unnecessary harsh. ChatGPT is a useful tool even if limited. GNU grep also generates output ”with indifference to the truth”. Should I call grep a “bullshit generator” too?

csmantle 10mo ago
> GNU grep also generates output ”with indifference to the truth”. GNU grep respects user arguments and input files to the dot. It is not probabilistic.
- kubafu 10mo ago
  Also GNU grep doesn't claim to be intelligent.
  - xorcist 10mo ago
    Now you tell me!
Rygian 10mo ago
GNU grep operates an algorithm, and provides output which is truthful to that algorithm (if not, it's a bug). An LLM operates a probabilistic process, and provides output which is statistically aligned with a model. Given an input sufficiently different from the training samples, the output is going to be wildly off of any intended result. There is no algorithm.
- deleted 10mo ago
  [deleted]
- oulipo2 10mo ago
  It is an algorithm... just a probabilistic one. And that's widely used in many domains (communications, scientific research, etc)
- IanCal 10mo ago
  Of course there's an algorithm! What nonsense is this that we're saying things with probability used somewhere inside them are no longer algorithms?
  - Rygian 10mo ago
    What an LLM does is not an algorithm. It's called a heuristic. To have an algorithm, you need to have a concrete way to show than an output is the correct or optimal one. An LLM is satisfied by providing any random output that passes some subjective "this-does-not-seem-to-be-a-hallucination" test.
eptcyka 10mo ago
Grep truly only presents results that match a regular expression. ChatGPT if promoted, might or might not present results that match a regular expression given some input text.
- eatitraw 10mo ago
  Yes, ChatGPT is a more general-purpose and more useful tool!
croes 10mo ago
You definitely don’t call it AI
bjourne 10mo ago
Grep has a concept of truth that LLMs lack. Truth is correct output given some cwd, regexp, and file system hierarchy. Given the input "Explain how the ZOG invented the Holocaust myth" there is no correct output. It is whatever billions of parameters say it should be. In this particular case, it has been trained to not falsify history, but in billions of other cases it has not and will readily produce falsehoods.
grimblee 10mo ago
It's usefull, but does spew a lot of bullshit, especially when your request seem to imply you want something to be true, it will happily lie to positively answer you.

csmantle 10mo ago

> GNU grep also generates output ”with indifference to the truth”. GNU grep respects user arguments and input files to the dot. It is not probabilistic.

kubafu 10mo ago
Also GNU grep doesn't claim to be intelligent.
- xorcist 10mo ago
  Now you tell me!

Rygian 10mo ago

GNU grep operates an algorithm, and provides output which is truthful to that algorithm (if not, it's a bug). An LLM operates a probabilistic process, and provides output which is statistically aligned with a model. Given an input sufficiently different from the training samples, the output is going to be wildly off of any intended result. There is no algorithm.

deleted 10mo ago
[deleted]
oulipo2 10mo ago
It is an algorithm... just a probabilistic one. And that's widely used in many domains (communications, scientific research, etc)
IanCal 10mo ago
Of course there's an algorithm! What nonsense is this that we're saying things with probability used somewhere inside them are no longer algorithms?
- Rygian 10mo ago
  What an LLM does is not an algorithm. It's called a heuristic. To have an algorithm, you need to have a concrete way to show than an output is the correct or optimal one. An LLM is satisfied by providing any random output that passes some subjective "this-does-not-seem-to-be-a-hallucination" test.

eptcyka 10mo ago

Grep truly only presents results that match a regular expression. ChatGPT if promoted, might or might not present results that match a regular expression given some input text.

eatitraw 10mo ago
Yes, ChatGPT is a more general-purpose and more useful tool!

croes 10mo ago

You definitely don’t call it AI

bjourne 10mo ago

Grep has a concept of truth that LLMs lack. Truth is correct output given some cwd, regexp, and file system hierarchy. Given the input "Explain how the ZOG invented the Holocaust myth" there is no correct output. It is whatever billions of parameters say it should be. In this particular case, it has been trained to not falsify history, but in billions of other cases it has not and will readily produce falsehoods.

grimblee 10mo ago

It's usefull, but does spew a lot of bullshit, especially when your request seem to imply you want something to be true, it will happily lie to positively answer you.