3 ms·

If "islamisation" is a problem, why then is Saudi-Arabia a close ally of the USA? I think it is more that Trump cannot collect bounties in the form of donation

by fjfaase 10mo ago

If "islamisation" is a problem, why then is Saudi-Arabia a close ally of the USA? I think it is more that Trump cannot collect bounties in the form of donations in his crypto currency in exchange for favors. Maybe it is also because they cannot cope with the idea that the 'socialist' Europe is doing well (lately even better than the USA) economical, while this goes to their ideas of what makes a nation strong. Also in other aspect such as safety, well being, freedom of press, and life expectancy many countries in Europe are doing better than the USA on average. The fact that the USA is normalizing relationships with Russia is felt as very worrying especially while painting the EU as an adversary. The USA is the only NATO country that activated article 5 and many European countries responded, but not the USA is saying they will not respond to article 5 if NATO countries in Europe is attacked by Russia.

mytailorisrich 10mo ago
Saudi Arabia and the US are bound by oil but Saudi Arabia is not a reliable ally beyond that. The relationship with Europe is very different and a much deeper alliance and cultural alignment (the Western world). Europe is falling behind economically. I certainly don't think that the US see them as a threat in that regards. It's more than European integration creates a single, more powerful bloc that can challenge the US.
- ben_w 10mo ago
  > Saudi Arabia and the US are bound by oil but Saudi Arabia is not a reliable ally beyond that. Oil is not an important part of the future. Why does Trump think it is? > The relationship with Europe is very different and a much deeper alliance and cultural alignment (the Western world). Ce n'est plus le cas. Trumps Agenda schadet den europäischen Wirtschafts- und Militärinteressen. La agenda de Trump es muy visible en sus intentos de interferir en las agendas políticas internas de la UE. Trumps dagsorden ses endda som en trussel mod suveræniteten, da den ikke udelukker militær magt til at tage kontrol over Grønland. (Meanwhile, the US loses its mind over Spanish; Και χρησιμοποιεί μόνο ελληνικά για αδελφότητες και γυναικείες αδελφότητες, which are strange and alien to us). The extent of cultural alignment today is that we use American software and online services and watch American shows, and through those services the use of the term "Black Friday"; but when we try to enforce our standards on online services, the Americans get all upset and how dare we have our own rules. Religiosity may be officially quite high in much of Europe, but in practice, we don't take it anything like as seriously as the USA seems to (and I'm saying that as someone who even went to a Catholic school when I was growing up in the UK); E anche quando le nostre valute hanno qualcosa da dire su Dio, troviamo un po' sciocco dire "una nazione sotto Dio". By and large, we don't want things like the 2nd Amendment, which the USA considers to be a "god given right"; and Germany, Netherlands, Switzerland, even the UK are a lot more open about sex and sexuality than anywhere I've seen in the USA. Completely different relationship with alcohol and food and cars and planes and national parks. The EU is what "small-government" Republicans say they want from the US federal government, while EU Republicans want to get rid of kings. EU nations are sovereign and free to leave, US states are not. Nie wszyscy używamy tej samej waluty. We celebrate the founding of universities multiple times older than the nation of the USA. Instead of fireworks for Independence Day as in the USA, the UK has them for "remembering a Catholic who failed to blow up the houses of parliament night". The USA does not care for Morris dancing and cheese rolling any more than the UK cares for the Superbowl or Thanksgiving. Trade just isn't that much of a tie, and what tie it does bring is weakened by Trump's tariffs. The historical connections are mostly the USA being filled with people whose ancestors fled Europe rather than current knowledge, and again this is likely to get worse thanks to Trump's behaviours here.
  - foldr 10mo ago
    I agree with your point, but feel I must add a pedantic note on Morris dancing. It's a pretty niche pursuit in the UK, and I have seen Morris dancers in the US (without even trying to). I wouldn't be surprised if the US has more Morris dancers than the UK.
  - mytailorisrich 10mo ago
    You highlight cultural differences to, frankly, labour your point. Cultural differences exist between every countries even of course within Europe itself. The point is the scale. The US and Europe are close culturally. As said, they created and are obviously part of the "Western Civilisation". Now, compare to, say, Afghanistan and suddenly all the cultural differences you highlighted between the US and Europe fade into insignificance. This is the whole point.
    - ben_w 10mo ago
      Those examples demonstrate that the US and the EU are not, in fact, close culturally. A lot of Americans would hate losing the 2nd A, and most of the Brits would be horrified to have it forced upon them. Vice versa for the NHS. Instead of hypothecating about Afghanistan, ask yourself who is closer culturally to a typical European welfare state, the USA or China's officially-but-kinda-soft-really communism? What about the USA or the still-not-coming-into-the-EU-but-says-it-wants-to Turkey? The USA or former French département Algeria? Hollywood or Bollywood? Or worse, when it's a question of the bad behaviour rather than the good, e.g. the USA now acting suspiciously towards Canada and Greenland and supporting Russia, versus the present active threat that is Russia?
      - mytailorisrich 10mo ago
        The US are much closer culturally to Europe than China is. Obviously. And I know both. China or Afghanistan are not "hypothecating", they are concrete and obvious examples. You keep trying to take contrieved examples to prove your (odd) point but that does not work because you are trying to prove something that is false. I don't understand why you are doing that... Too much Kool-Aid is bad for health.

by fjfaase 10mo ago

mytailorisrich 10mo ago

Saudi Arabia and the US are bound by oil but Saudi Arabia is not a reliable ally beyond that. The relationship with Europe is very different and a much deeper alliance and cultural alignment (the Western world). Europe is falling behind economically. I certainly don't think that the US see them as a threat in that regards. It's more than European integration creates a single, more powerful bloc that can challenge the US.

ben_w 10mo ago
> Saudi Arabia and the US are bound by oil but Saudi Arabia is not a reliable ally beyond that. Oil is not an important part of the future. Why does Trump think it is? > The relationship with Europe is very different and a much deeper alliance and cultural alignment (the Western world). Ce n'est plus le cas. Trumps Agenda schadet den europäischen Wirtschafts- und Militärinteressen. La agenda de Trump es muy visible en sus intentos de interferir en las agendas políticas internas de la UE. Trumps dagsorden ses endda som en trussel mod suveræniteten, da den ikke udelukker militær magt til at tage kontrol over Grønland. (Meanwhile, the US loses its mind over Spanish; Και χρησιμοποιεί μόνο ελληνικά για αδελφότητες και γυναικείες αδελφότητες, which are strange and alien to us). The extent of cultural alignment today is that we use American software and online services and watch American shows, and through those services the use of the term "Black Friday"; but when we try to enforce our standards on online services, the Americans get all upset and how dare we have our own rules. Religiosity may be officially quite high in much of Europe, but in practice, we don't take it anything like as seriously as the USA seems to (and I'm saying that as someone who even went to a Catholic school when I was growing up in the UK); E anche quando le nostre valute hanno qualcosa da dire su Dio, troviamo un po' sciocco dire "una nazione sotto Dio". By and large, we don't want things like the 2nd Amendment, which the USA considers to be a "god given right"; and Germany, Netherlands, Switzerland, even the UK are a lot more open about sex and sexuality than anywhere I've seen in the USA. Completely different relationship with alcohol and food and cars and planes and national parks. The EU is what "small-government" Republicans say they want from the US federal government, while EU Republicans want to get rid of kings. EU nations are sovereign and free to leave, US states are not. Nie wszyscy używamy tej samej waluty. We celebrate the founding of universities multiple times older than the nation of the USA. Instead of fireworks for Independence Day as in the USA, the UK has them for "remembering a Catholic who failed to blow up the houses of parliament night". The USA does not care for Morris dancing and cheese rolling any more than the UK cares for the Superbowl or Thanksgiving. Trade just isn't that much of a tie, and what tie it does bring is weakened by Trump's tariffs. The historical connections are mostly the USA being filled with people whose ancestors fled Europe rather than current knowledge, and again this is likely to get worse thanks to Trump's behaviours here.
- foldr 10mo ago
  I agree with your point, but feel I must add a pedantic note on Morris dancing. It's a pretty niche pursuit in the UK, and I have seen Morris dancers in the US (without even trying to). I wouldn't be surprised if the US has more Morris dancers than the UK.
- mytailorisrich 10mo ago
  You highlight cultural differences to, frankly, labour your point. Cultural differences exist between every countries even of course within Europe itself. The point is the scale. The US and Europe are close culturally. As said, they created and are obviously part of the "Western Civilisation". Now, compare to, say, Afghanistan and suddenly all the cultural differences you highlighted between the US and Europe fade into insignificance. This is the whole point.
  - ben_w 10mo ago
    Those examples demonstrate that the US and the EU are not, in fact, close culturally. A lot of Americans would hate losing the 2nd A, and most of the Brits would be horrified to have it forced upon them. Vice versa for the NHS. Instead of hypothecating about Afghanistan, ask yourself who is closer culturally to a typical European welfare state, the USA or China's officially-but-kinda-soft-really communism? What about the USA or the still-not-coming-into-the-EU-but-says-it-wants-to Turkey? The USA or former French département Algeria? Hollywood or Bollywood? Or worse, when it's a question of the bad behaviour rather than the good, e.g. the USA now acting suspiciously towards Canada and Greenland and supporting Russia, versus the present active threat that is Russia?
    - mytailorisrich 10mo ago
      The US are much closer culturally to Europe than China is. Obviously. And I know both. China or Afghanistan are not "hypothecating", they are concrete and obvious examples. You keep trying to take contrieved examples to prove your (odd) point but that does not work because you are trying to prove something that is false. I don't understand why you are doing that... Too much Kool-Aid is bad for health.