5 ms·

I think a lot of young people look at all of the wars waged post-WWII and are rightfully opposed to fighting for their governments. Would you want to die for no

I think a lot of young people look at all of the wars waged post-WWII and are rightfully opposed to fighting for their governments. Would you want to die for nothing in Vietnam? Probably not, and a lot of other people didn't want to as well. Some of them did anyway, and it was all for nothing. So please have some grace if today's kids have looked back at our miserable history and have decided that they'd rather not die for a country that doesn't seem to give a shit about them.

fabian2k 11mo ago
Germany didn't fight in Vietnam.
- venturecruelty 11mo ago
  Missing the point.
- bgwalter 11mo ago
  They were in Afghanistan and the U.S. would have no problems with setting up other EU countries as proxies against Russia in order to get Russia out of countries like Syria and Venezuela (as has now happened, courtesy of the Ukrainians). The Venezuelan escalation happened after the Alaska Summit, and God knows what tradeoffs were made there verbally and with full deniability. A strong army is only good if you have a strong, independent foreign policy. German chancellors used to be able to contradict the U.S., but that is no longer a given.
appreciatorBus 11mo ago
Putin will happily take over your home, even if you thought Viet Nam was a waste.
- jasonvorhe 11mo ago
  Had to imagine Putin moving into someone's 45sqm flat in the suburbs after his evil empire invaded somewhere. Had to chuckle, thanks for that.
  - hkpack 11mo ago
    Yeah, it will technically not be Putin himself, but someone from russia's poor regions, while you will be forcibly send to the grinder. This all happened multiple times, and the only reason you can chuckle is ignorance.
    - jasonvorhe 11mo ago
      I chuckled because of the s/Russia/Putin/g nonsense everywhere. I'm not laughing at anyone's expense if they forcibly lose their home, no matter where and under which circumstances.
      - hkpack 11mo ago
        You see, millions are already killed in the biggest war in Europe since WW2 and it looks like this is just the prelude. Russia is threatening to fight Europe as of yesterday, continue to increase weapon production and militarisation. It is obvious that it just cannot stop as its economy and social order is switching more and more to the war-time. China backs russia up and officially declaring that it cannot allow Russia to lose. The alliance which was created specifically to stop this scenario is now being neutralised by US withdrawing from it. And you still call it "Russia/Putin nonsense". Do you live somewhere where you feel isolated from all of this? Please tell me so I can go there as well. Because at the place where I live - Russians drones are flying over important infrastructure mapping it out without government/military being able to stop it. Russians propaganda fills social media, and politicians are corrupted by russia without hiding it too much.
        jasonvorhe 11mo ago
        You misunderstand. I'm not against reporting about Russia. The oversimplification of reducing everything down to "Putin this, Putin that" is my issue. Imagine me saying everything the EU is doing is explicitly because of Ursel. It's stupid, ignorant and reminds me of Trump Derangement Syndrome which had a similar effect on reporting about US issues. I live in Germany so I'm fucked either way. I'm also aware of NATO expansion until a point where Russia couldn't ignore it anymore. You think Russia will attack Europe, I think the West is keen on fighting a war against Russia. I don't subscribe to any of the narratives you presented, especially since I think it obvious that its the West that finds itself having to wage a war because their currencies, social order and demographics needing a reset. NATO being a defensive alliance is a joke. Since we're unlikely to come closer to an understanding I'll refrain from going further. Sometimes it's just easier to agree to disagree. May we all live through this somehow.
- Nextgrid 11mo ago
  You mean the home of a boomer that you have to continuously pay an ever-increasing share of your wages for so he can just sit there and live off your labor? I don't think you'll find much sympathy for that class among the people this reform is targeting.
- samdoesnothing 11mo ago
  Haha you think the youth own homes? It'll be young people dying so old people get richer just like every other war.
wkat4242 11mo ago
Exactly. Even after Vietnam, in this century. Iraq war 2 was all false pretenses. And the resulting power vacuum created ISIS. Afghanistan accomplished absolutely nothing, things are back to the way it was and all the deaths were for nothing. The only fairly recent war that the west was involved in that was slightly justified was the first gulf war. But even that wasn't really any of America's business. It wasn't that they actually cared about the Kuwaiti people. Just the oil.
- threatofrain 11mo ago
  But do people think American will translate to Germany?
  - aaomidi 11mo ago
    Germany took part in a lot of those wars.
    - IAmBroom 11mo ago
      Did it? Genuine question. I thought they were mostly prohibited by their constitution (a.k.a. what the Allies thought was best) from engaging in offensive warfare.
      - aaomidi 11mo ago
        They didn’t consider them offensive. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_Germany?wprov=sfti1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_Germany...
- C6JEsQeQa5fCjE 11mo ago
  > and all the deaths were for nothing Deaths and destruction in wars against significantly weaker countries are never for nothing, as certain well-connected people always get filthy rich, regardless of the end result. The ones who make the decisions, they always get their share, whether through the war hardware industry, mercenary business, the reconstruction industry, the resource exploitation industry, or something else. The wider population might end up worse off and poorer, but who has ever asked them about anything when there is so much money to be made by their ''democratic representatives'' if they play along?
fifilura 11mo ago
Conscripts are generally not allowed to be moved abroad.
mzhaase 11mo ago
Germany already had mandatory conscription for a long time and not once were conscripts send abroad.
energy123 11mo ago
An attempt at mind reading to market an opinion

fabian2k 11mo ago

Germany didn't fight in Vietnam.

venturecruelty 11mo ago
Missing the point.
bgwalter 11mo ago
They were in Afghanistan and the U.S. would have no problems with setting up other EU countries as proxies against Russia in order to get Russia out of countries like Syria and Venezuela (as has now happened, courtesy of the Ukrainians). The Venezuelan escalation happened after the Alaska Summit, and God knows what tradeoffs were made there verbally and with full deniability. A strong army is only good if you have a strong, independent foreign policy. German chancellors used to be able to contradict the U.S., but that is no longer a given.

appreciatorBus 11mo ago

Putin will happily take over your home, even if you thought Viet Nam was a waste.

jasonvorhe 11mo ago
Had to imagine Putin moving into someone's 45sqm flat in the suburbs after his evil empire invaded somewhere. Had to chuckle, thanks for that.
- hkpack 11mo ago
  Yeah, it will technically not be Putin himself, but someone from russia's poor regions, while you will be forcibly send to the grinder. This all happened multiple times, and the only reason you can chuckle is ignorance.
  - jasonvorhe 11mo ago
    I chuckled because of the s/Russia/Putin/g nonsense everywhere. I'm not laughing at anyone's expense if they forcibly lose their home, no matter where and under which circumstances.
    - hkpack 11mo ago
      You see, millions are already killed in the biggest war in Europe since WW2 and it looks like this is just the prelude. Russia is threatening to fight Europe as of yesterday, continue to increase weapon production and militarisation. It is obvious that it just cannot stop as its economy and social order is switching more and more to the war-time. China backs russia up and officially declaring that it cannot allow Russia to lose. The alliance which was created specifically to stop this scenario is now being neutralised by US withdrawing from it. And you still call it "Russia/Putin nonsense". Do you live somewhere where you feel isolated from all of this? Please tell me so I can go there as well. Because at the place where I live - Russians drones are flying over important infrastructure mapping it out without government/military being able to stop it. Russians propaganda fills social media, and politicians are corrupted by russia without hiding it too much.
      - jasonvorhe 11mo ago
        You misunderstand. I'm not against reporting about Russia. The oversimplification of reducing everything down to "Putin this, Putin that" is my issue. Imagine me saying everything the EU is doing is explicitly because of Ursel. It's stupid, ignorant and reminds me of Trump Derangement Syndrome which had a similar effect on reporting about US issues. I live in Germany so I'm fucked either way. I'm also aware of NATO expansion until a point where Russia couldn't ignore it anymore. You think Russia will attack Europe, I think the West is keen on fighting a war against Russia. I don't subscribe to any of the narratives you presented, especially since I think it obvious that its the West that finds itself having to wage a war because their currencies, social order and demographics needing a reset. NATO being a defensive alliance is a joke. Since we're unlikely to come closer to an understanding I'll refrain from going further. Sometimes it's just easier to agree to disagree. May we all live through this somehow.
Nextgrid 11mo ago
You mean the home of a boomer that you have to continuously pay an ever-increasing share of your wages for so he can just sit there and live off your labor? I don't think you'll find much sympathy for that class among the people this reform is targeting.
samdoesnothing 11mo ago
Haha you think the youth own homes? It'll be young people dying so old people get richer just like every other war.

wkat4242 11mo ago

Exactly. Even after Vietnam, in this century. Iraq war 2 was all false pretenses. And the resulting power vacuum created ISIS. Afghanistan accomplished absolutely nothing, things are back to the way it was and all the deaths were for nothing. The only fairly recent war that the west was involved in that was slightly justified was the first gulf war. But even that wasn't really any of America's business. It wasn't that they actually cared about the Kuwaiti people. Just the oil.

threatofrain 11mo ago
But do people think American will translate to Germany?
- aaomidi 11mo ago
  Germany took part in a lot of those wars.
  - IAmBroom 11mo ago
    Did it? Genuine question. I thought they were mostly prohibited by their constitution (a.k.a. what the Allies thought was best) from engaging in offensive warfare.
    - aaomidi 11mo ago
      They didn’t consider them offensive. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_Germany?wprov=sfti1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_Germany...
C6JEsQeQa5fCjE 11mo ago
> and all the deaths were for nothing Deaths and destruction in wars against significantly weaker countries are never for nothing, as certain well-connected people always get filthy rich, regardless of the end result. The ones who make the decisions, they always get their share, whether through the war hardware industry, mercenary business, the reconstruction industry, the resource exploitation industry, or something else. The wider population might end up worse off and poorer, but who has ever asked them about anything when there is so much money to be made by their ''democratic representatives'' if they play along?

fifilura 11mo ago

Conscripts are generally not allowed to be moved abroad.

mzhaase 11mo ago

Germany already had mandatory conscription for a long time and not once were conscripts send abroad.

energy123 11mo ago

An attempt at mind reading to market an opinion