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I don't have much faith in Arm Linux. Tuxedo gave up. Cheap Windows Arm laptops are flooding the market, if someone can pick ONE laptop to support they could e

I don't have much faith in Arm Linux. Tuxedo gave up. Cheap Windows Arm laptops are flooding the market, if someone can pick ONE laptop to support they could easily buy them on sale , refurbished them with Linux and make a profit. Looks likes their are some challenges with doing this.

winterqt 11mo ago
Supposedly the ARM ThinkPads are alright on Linux.
- jonkoops 11mo ago
  Not really. The drivers are not upstream, so it only works well on specially made Ubuntu spins that carry out of tree patches and random binary blobs. It is really still quite a mess at the moment.
  - danans 11mo ago
    > It is really still quite a mess at the moment. Integration, testing, and support are all expensive. Right or wrong, that's a reason why if a laptop "just works" (like a Mac, Windows Thinkpad, or a Chromebook), it probably has proprietary binaries. Also, if you aren't paying for the OS (via the hardware it's coupled with), you can't expect the OS to have the benefits of tight hardware integration. Even Framework laptops use proprietary boot firmware, and they've been pretty clear that they only provide support for Ubuntu and Fedora, not the alphabet soup of other Linux desktop distros.
    - jonkoops 11mo ago
      Nonsense, the AMD drivers are fully upstream, and they 'just work'.
      - danans 11mo ago
        AMD drivers alone do not make a computer that "just works".
embedding-shape 11mo ago
> I don't have much faith in Arm Linux. Tuxedo gave up. I was also slowly loosing hope, although I do still run some NixOS ARM Raspberry PIs. But with the recent Valve backing, I'm back on the train again, and eagerly awaiting the slow but steady improvements, and figuring out where I can contribute back.
blisstonia 11mo ago
They probably gave up on their Snapdragon X efforts as Snapdragon X2 Elite was nipping at their heels and they'd have a redundant device by the time their efforts came to market.
alecsm 11mo ago
Valve is gonna save the day once again.
- pjmlp 11mo ago
  Running Windows stuff.....
  - bigyabai 11mo ago
    I quite prefer that to the alternative of not running Windows stuff.
    - pjmlp 11mo ago
      Thing is, that strengths Windows market relevance, as IBM learnt with OS/2 and its Windows compatibility.
      - bigyabai 11mo ago
        Good. I love exploiting Windows' market relevance, it's rather fun and engaging.
        pjmlp 11mo ago
        Until like IBM found out, devalues the underlying offer enough that it becomes irrelevant.
  - alecsm 11mo ago
    I don't use Windows but I do run a lot of software made only for Windows. I don't see any problem with that.
    - pjmlp 11mo ago
      Until the fountain runs dry, because the kingdom lords diverted the river from Valve's well castle.
darksaints 11mo ago
Honestly, I don't have much faith in Linux anymore, and it has everything to do with the explosion of the kernel's codebase due to the explosion of cheaper devices running linux and the (admittedly difficult) management issues surrounding the kernel. I feel like from a security perspective, macos is a better choice and that pains me as a long time linux user. Can we please move on to microkernels already? I'm fine with a tiny performance hit, I just don't want to get rooted because I plugged in the wrong USB stick.
- bigyabai 11mo ago
  You can use microkernels whenever you want. Just be aware that they typically have the same issues with zombie/cruft code and aren't necessarily more secure for every application.
  - whizzter 11mo ago
    I think the point is that even drivers could be non-trusted and live outside of the kernel and just provide the exact service required with minimal access. That said, why do we still need drivers in 2025? Most regular printers should be dumb, U-MASS should be dumb, webcams should be dumb, monitors are dumb, etc... very few devices coming really needs custom drivers anymore (even with many customizations we could provide class specific descriptors that drivers could adhere to).
- 999900000999 11mo ago
  I want a 4TB SSD. To do that on a MacBook I'm spending a minimum of 3200$. If you have unlimited money ( or can expense it) a 3200$ to 4k MacBook is going to be the best experience money can buy. If you have limited funds, a 200$ used computer can get the job done with the right distro.
- bayindirh 11mo ago
  If you don't want to go macOS route and want to leave Linux world, your destination would be FreeBSD or OpenBSD. On the other hand, if you're not running Wine, you can't get autorun virii from USB drives, plus the Windows virii just lives there and can't do anything.
kidfiji 11mo ago
Valve seems to be putting a lot of resources into this area for their Steam Frame
tensor 11mo ago
Do you mean "desktop arm linux"? Because AWS, Google, and others all run Linux on their arm servers and that market segment is only growing.
- H1Supreme 11mo ago
  I've been running ARM VM's on my M1 MBP for the last few years, and outside of the very beginning, it's been pretty smooth sailing.
whalesalad 11mo ago
We run a handful of Linux workloads on Graviton without any issues.

winterqt 11mo ago

Supposedly the ARM ThinkPads are alright on Linux.

jonkoops 11mo ago
Not really. The drivers are not upstream, so it only works well on specially made Ubuntu spins that carry out of tree patches and random binary blobs. It is really still quite a mess at the moment.
- danans 11mo ago
  > It is really still quite a mess at the moment. Integration, testing, and support are all expensive. Right or wrong, that's a reason why if a laptop "just works" (like a Mac, Windows Thinkpad, or a Chromebook), it probably has proprietary binaries. Also, if you aren't paying for the OS (via the hardware it's coupled with), you can't expect the OS to have the benefits of tight hardware integration. Even Framework laptops use proprietary boot firmware, and they've been pretty clear that they only provide support for Ubuntu and Fedora, not the alphabet soup of other Linux desktop distros.
  - jonkoops 11mo ago
    Nonsense, the AMD drivers are fully upstream, and they 'just work'.
    - danans 11mo ago
      AMD drivers alone do not make a computer that "just works".

embedding-shape 11mo ago

> I don't have much faith in Arm Linux. Tuxedo gave up. I was also slowly loosing hope, although I do still run some NixOS ARM Raspberry PIs. But with the recent Valve backing, I'm back on the train again, and eagerly awaiting the slow but steady improvements, and figuring out where I can contribute back.

blisstonia 11mo ago

They probably gave up on their Snapdragon X efforts as Snapdragon X2 Elite was nipping at their heels and they'd have a redundant device by the time their efforts came to market.

alecsm 11mo ago

Valve is gonna save the day once again.

pjmlp 11mo ago
Running Windows stuff.....
- bigyabai 11mo ago
  I quite prefer that to the alternative of not running Windows stuff.
  - pjmlp 11mo ago
    Thing is, that strengths Windows market relevance, as IBM learnt with OS/2 and its Windows compatibility.
    - bigyabai 11mo ago
      Good. I love exploiting Windows' market relevance, it's rather fun and engaging.
      - pjmlp 11mo ago
        Until like IBM found out, devalues the underlying offer enough that it becomes irrelevant.
- alecsm 11mo ago
  I don't use Windows but I do run a lot of software made only for Windows. I don't see any problem with that.
  - pjmlp 11mo ago
    Until the fountain runs dry, because the kingdom lords diverted the river from Valve's well castle.

darksaints 11mo ago

Honestly, I don't have much faith in Linux anymore, and it has everything to do with the explosion of the kernel's codebase due to the explosion of cheaper devices running linux and the (admittedly difficult) management issues surrounding the kernel. I feel like from a security perspective, macos is a better choice and that pains me as a long time linux user. Can we please move on to microkernels already? I'm fine with a tiny performance hit, I just don't want to get rooted because I plugged in the wrong USB stick.

bigyabai 11mo ago
You can use microkernels whenever you want. Just be aware that they typically have the same issues with zombie/cruft code and aren't necessarily more secure for every application.
- whizzter 11mo ago
  I think the point is that even drivers could be non-trusted and live outside of the kernel and just provide the exact service required with minimal access. That said, why do we still need drivers in 2025? Most regular printers should be dumb, U-MASS should be dumb, webcams should be dumb, monitors are dumb, etc... very few devices coming really needs custom drivers anymore (even with many customizations we could provide class specific descriptors that drivers could adhere to).
999900000999 11mo ago
I want a 4TB SSD. To do that on a MacBook I'm spending a minimum of 3200$. If you have unlimited money ( or can expense it) a 3200$ to 4k MacBook is going to be the best experience money can buy. If you have limited funds, a 200$ used computer can get the job done with the right distro.
bayindirh 11mo ago
If you don't want to go macOS route and want to leave Linux world, your destination would be FreeBSD or OpenBSD. On the other hand, if you're not running Wine, you can't get autorun virii from USB drives, plus the Windows virii just lives there and can't do anything.

kidfiji 11mo ago

Valve seems to be putting a lot of resources into this area for their Steam Frame

tensor 11mo ago

Do you mean "desktop arm linux"? Because AWS, Google, and others all run Linux on their arm servers and that market segment is only growing.

H1Supreme 11mo ago
I've been running ARM VM's on my M1 MBP for the last few years, and outside of the very beginning, it's been pretty smooth sailing.

whalesalad 11mo ago

We run a handful of Linux workloads on Graviton without any issues.