5 ms·

How are US made vehicles dangerous?

georgefrowny 11mo ago
If they don't meet EU safety standards, they are, by definition, legally unsafe for sale in the EU. Front sightlines are a common example given for larger pickups and SUVs. Pedestrian outcomes in collisions are also given more weight in the EU standards (which is why you can't buy a Cybertruck). American semi trucks are also generally considered unsafe for that reason plus overall length - nearly all EU and UK HGVs are cabover models. There's no rule againt US-made vehicles. It's just that many vehicle models that happen to be made and sold in the US don't meet safety requirements in other places. You can well argue that EU vehicle standards are excessively strict (many EU residents may agree or disagree on various aspects), but coming at it from "very unfair trade, it's a huge deficit, sad!" angle seems more like simping for car manufacturers then reasonable public safety policy tuning.
- ExoticPearTree 11mo ago
  > nearly all EU and UK HGVs are cabover models and > There's no rule against US-made vehicles. It feels very much an anti-US rule to me.
  - georgefrowny 11mo ago
    It feels very much like a self-inflicted problem that manufacturers made by lobbying for domestic rules that they knew to be incompatible with foreign markets, followed by inability to innovate sufficiently to supply both markets economically. I have no sympathy with this plight. They should take responsibility for their past choices. They have agency, they're not victims. It's not even that you can't see big pickups in the EU, there are plenty of Hiluxen and even Chinese brands like Maxus (SAIC) could figure out how make an EU-compliant vehicle (much as I think even such models are undesirable to share roads with). It's also not there are no US imports - there are, when the models comply with local regulation.
  - Tor3 11mo ago
    "It feels very much an anti-US rule to me." It isn't. Quite the opposite. It's about a level playing field. There are standards for allowing products to market, some of them are more costly to implement. US car makers want to sell at lower standards than competitors, that's not a level playing field.
    - ExoticPearTree 11mo ago
      The would be customers should decide that. If they want a car that is bigger, harder to park, has poor fuel consumption and so on.
      - saubeidl 11mo ago
        So if I want to, I should be able to drive a literal tank? What a poorly thought out argument. Cars are a danger to others, that's why your own choices shouldn't be the only thing that matters.
        ExoticPearTree 11mo ago
        Yes, like in the US - you can get a permit to drive one around.
        saubeidl 11mo ago
        On public roads?
        ExoticPearTree 11mo ago
        Obviously.
      - Tor3 11mo ago
        The customer has no right to deside on issues that affect _others_. A customer can decide on what affects the customer. If car A is more dangerous for other people than car B, then it's for somebody else than the car customer to decide what should be allowed. A car owner can't decide that "it's fine to drive this car which will kill other people because of its design".

If they don't meet EU safety standards, they are, by definition, legally unsafe for sale in the EU. Front sightlines are a common example given for larger pickups and SUVs. Pedestrian outcomes in collisions are also given more weight in the EU standards (which is why you can't buy a Cybertruck). American semi trucks are also generally considered unsafe for that reason plus overall length - nearly all EU and UK HGVs are cabover models. There's no rule againt US-made vehicles. It's just that many vehicle models that happen to be made and sold in the US don't meet safety requirements in other places. You can well argue that EU vehicle standards are excessively strict (many EU residents may agree or disagree on various aspects), but coming at it from "very unfair trade, it's a huge deficit, sad!" angle seems more like simping for car manufacturers then reasonable public safety policy tuning.

ExoticPearTree 11mo ago
> nearly all EU and UK HGVs are cabover models and > There's no rule against US-made vehicles. It feels very much an anti-US rule to me.
- georgefrowny 11mo ago
  It feels very much like a self-inflicted problem that manufacturers made by lobbying for domestic rules that they knew to be incompatible with foreign markets, followed by inability to innovate sufficiently to supply both markets economically. I have no sympathy with this plight. They should take responsibility for their past choices. They have agency, they're not victims. It's not even that you can't see big pickups in the EU, there are plenty of Hiluxen and even Chinese brands like Maxus (SAIC) could figure out how make an EU-compliant vehicle (much as I think even such models are undesirable to share roads with). It's also not there are no US imports - there are, when the models comply with local regulation.
- Tor3 11mo ago
  "It feels very much an anti-US rule to me." It isn't. Quite the opposite. It's about a level playing field. There are standards for allowing products to market, some of them are more costly to implement. US car makers want to sell at lower standards than competitors, that's not a level playing field.
  - ExoticPearTree 11mo ago
    The would be customers should decide that. If they want a car that is bigger, harder to park, has poor fuel consumption and so on.
    - saubeidl 11mo ago
      So if I want to, I should be able to drive a literal tank? What a poorly thought out argument. Cars are a danger to others, that's why your own choices shouldn't be the only thing that matters.
      - ExoticPearTree 11mo ago
        Yes, like in the US - you can get a permit to drive one around.
        saubeidl 11mo ago
        On public roads?
        ExoticPearTree 11mo ago
        Obviously.
    - Tor3 11mo ago
      The customer has no right to deside on issues that affect _others_. A customer can decide on what affects the customer. If car A is more dangerous for other people than car B, then it's for somebody else than the car customer to decide what should be allowed. A car owner can't decide that "it's fine to drive this car which will kill other people because of its design".