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> And then you risk people making stupid decisions, which you have to fix later on, because you didn't attend the meeting. Unless your head is on the line, why

> And then you risk people making stupid decisions, which you have to fix later on, because you didn't attend the meeting. Unless your head is on the line, why do you care?

delusional 11mo ago
Because caring about your work, the people around you, and the quite frankly stuff in general is healthy and gives life meaning. If you go somewhere 8 hours a day, you'd like that place to matter to you. Anything else is just depressing.
- munk-a 11mo ago
  You are correct that caring is important - but it also isn't your responsibility at the end of the day. If you don't care you're doing it wrong - if you let it eat you up inside whenever anything goes wrong you're also doing it wrong. Work-life balance is mostly talked about in terms of time commitments but there is also an emotional commitment you need to balance. It's unhealthy to be too far in either extreme and, especially folks that are naturally empathetic, should be more wary of falling into the trap of overinvesting in a workplace and suffering mentally for it.
- geoffbp 11mo ago
  Great comment. Username doesn’t check out! :)
makeitdouble 11mo ago
Someone explicitely asked for your input, you refused and they fucked up. Your head might nor roll, but you won't be unscaved either. If it's not as your responsibility, it will be by the size and impact of the fuckup. IMHO it'l should be the same approach as any other human communication: not everything can be fixed, and at some point you'll need to compromise. Some people talk slowly, will you refuse to listen to them if they don't speed up to some given wpm ? Some take time to come to their actual point. It might be utterly uncomfortable, but if they actually tend to have very good points, you'll probably bear with it.
kortilla 11mo ago
As a manager or even a technical leader, your head IS on the line, it just might not seem so obvious. Rollout delays, customer debacles, etc all shape your image to promo panels. If you’re just a junior engineer, it’s not like it will be held against you, but you certainly missed an opportunity to demonstrate ownership and make a name for yourself as one of the 1 in 20 people who aren’t NPCs.
- wiseowise 11mo ago
  > but you certainly missed an opportunity to demonstrate ownership and make a name for yourself as one of the 1 in 20 people who aren’t NPCs Depends on a company where you work. At our org you’ll get nothing out of it but headache, salary doesn’t change either way.
somanyphotons 11mo ago
Your head might not be, but you might find yourself being unhappily cleaning up a mess for months
- wiseowise 11mo ago
  > Your head might not be, but you might find yourself being unhappily cleaning up a mess for months From my experience it is going to happen regardless of whether you pay attention or not. People will fuck up, period. Compulsively being hypervigilant will drive you insane.
icedchai 11mo ago
Some people want the projects they're involved with to actually be successful?

> And then you risk people making stupid decisions, which you have to fix later on, because you didn't attend the meeting. Unless your head is on the line, why do you care?

delusional 11mo ago

Because caring about your work, the people around you, and the quite frankly stuff in general is healthy and gives life meaning. If you go somewhere 8 hours a day, you'd like that place to matter to you. Anything else is just depressing.

munk-a 11mo ago
You are correct that caring is important - but it also isn't your responsibility at the end of the day. If you don't care you're doing it wrong - if you let it eat you up inside whenever anything goes wrong you're also doing it wrong. Work-life balance is mostly talked about in terms of time commitments but there is also an emotional commitment you need to balance. It's unhealthy to be too far in either extreme and, especially folks that are naturally empathetic, should be more wary of falling into the trap of overinvesting in a workplace and suffering mentally for it.
geoffbp 11mo ago
Great comment. Username doesn’t check out! :)

makeitdouble 11mo ago

Someone explicitely asked for your input, you refused and they fucked up. Your head might nor roll, but you won't be unscaved either. If it's not as your responsibility, it will be by the size and impact of the fuckup. IMHO it'l should be the same approach as any other human communication: not everything can be fixed, and at some point you'll need to compromise. Some people talk slowly, will you refuse to listen to them if they don't speed up to some given wpm ? Some take time to come to their actual point. It might be utterly uncomfortable, but if they actually tend to have very good points, you'll probably bear with it.

kortilla 11mo ago

As a manager or even a technical leader, your head IS on the line, it just might not seem so obvious. Rollout delays, customer debacles, etc all shape your image to promo panels. If you’re just a junior engineer, it’s not like it will be held against you, but you certainly missed an opportunity to demonstrate ownership and make a name for yourself as one of the 1 in 20 people who aren’t NPCs.

wiseowise 11mo ago
> but you certainly missed an opportunity to demonstrate ownership and make a name for yourself as one of the 1 in 20 people who aren’t NPCs Depends on a company where you work. At our org you’ll get nothing out of it but headache, salary doesn’t change either way.

somanyphotons 11mo ago

Your head might not be, but you might find yourself being unhappily cleaning up a mess for months

wiseowise 11mo ago
> Your head might not be, but you might find yourself being unhappily cleaning up a mess for months From my experience it is going to happen regardless of whether you pay attention or not. People will fuck up, period. Compulsively being hypervigilant will drive you insane.

icedchai 11mo ago

Some people want the projects they're involved with to actually be successful?