4 ms·

A big part of why marketplaces like Netflix and Steam got so popular is because they provided a low-friction way to consume that was even easier than piracy. It

A big part of why marketplaces like Netflix and Steam got so popular is because they provided a low-friction way to consume that was even easier than piracy. It seems like the pendulum is starting to swing in the other direction now- it's often easier to copyright infringe than to watch something the legit way, even if you pay for a subscription that grants you access. Great example of something that's illegal but not morally wrong :)

jlengrand 11mo ago
Between this, the ads on paid plans, and the fragmentation of catalogues, we've come full circle.
WorldPeas 11mo ago
the difference of course being that valve /has/ to keep their customers happy because their average user is savvy at least with browsing the internet, the same can't be said of streaming consumers, many whom I know are emigres from the now-decaying cable infrastructure. Netflix knows this and squeezes their customer base, and while I would like to assume the altruism of Steam, whether by their own design or the will of the public, a solution with friction that low is all that works with that target market.
ffsm8 11mo ago
I wish there was a service like steam for videos: not subscription but high confidence purchase of video content available "forever" (even if they remove it from the purchasing options, license would remain). Personally I watch so little tv/movies that any subscription was always overpaying. I still did it for a while, because the price wasn't high enough to push me to seek out other options. I'm no longer subbing and moved on, but the right holders are seriously detached from reality if they think this is a sane business strategy
- Terretta 11mo ago
  > I wish there was a service like steam for videos: not subscription but high confidence purchase of video content available "forever" (even if they remove it from the purchasing options, license would remain). In general, iTunes content purchase licenses are owned in perpetuity. You do need to download the bits and have the files on hand, as (a) Apple may lose the right to re-deliver the bits to you, or (b) you may change regions (e.g., move from Australia to Canada) and find the re-download isn't available in the new region. A good deal of stories were published in 2018 about Apple revoking or removing content, but when threads are pulled, the examples generally fell into these two camps. If you had kept the content yourself, you got to keep enjoying it. > Personally I watch so little tv/movies that any subscription was always overpaying Agree there's a good chance many households could purchase their preferred shows for less than the "watch throwaway stuff" subscriptions -- and then own them. This suggests a more ideal pairing is purchasing, plus something like Pluto.
  - tonyedgecombe 11mo ago
    >In general, iTunes content purchase licenses are owned in perpetuity. All my purchased music on iTunes disappeared. Luckily I had kept copies of the files.
  - fragmede 11mo ago
    Or, just buy it on any platform and then feel less bad about pirating it anyway.
- bryanlarsen 11mo ago
  $30 for a season pass from iTunes seemed like a ridiculous price until you do the math and realize that it really isn't.
jandrese 11mo ago
This is no joke. I tried watching the latest episode of Plur1bus on Apple TV+ on my laptop and here's the steps I went through: 1. Start chrome, navigate to tv.apple.com, click on the #1 show of the day (no problem) 2. The site tells me I can sign up for the TV service that I already have instead of offering a play button. 3. I click on the "sign up" which pauses for 10 seconds then tells me I'm already subscribed why did I hit the button you idiot. 4. I back arrow to the original page, it still asks me to sign up, hit F5 a couple of times to no effect. 5. Reload tv.apple.com from the start and navigate to the page, now it finally shows a play button. 6. Hit the play button but it gives me a popup saying that I need to verify the three digits off of the back of my credit card. I enter the digits and click the next button, but nothing happens. 7. Off to Google where I learn that if that happens you can log into accounts.apple.com first to avoid it. 8. I go through the login process on apple's site, which involves pulling out my phone to scan a QR code. 9. On the Apple site I try to go to the AppleTV+ options, which requires a second QR scan on my phone because it's apparently a different account. 10. On the site I verify that it shows the ATV+ subscription is active. 11. Return to tv.apple.com and click on the show to see that it again says I need to sign up to the service. 12. Click on the sign up button again to be told that I'm already subscribed. 13. Go back and reload the page entirely again so the play button reappears. 14. Click on the play button and get asked for the three digits again. Groan. 15. This time the next button actually works (miracle!) and it loads a second page talking about parental controls with another non-working button on the bottom. 16. I close the window and click on my profile in the upper right, verify that the parental controls are off. 17. Attempt to watch again, but again get stuck doing the 3 digit verify and get stuck on the parental controls window. 18. Go back to the settings and try turning on parental controls, which requires setting a PIN and doing another account verification, but leaving them on the most permissive settings. 19. Return to the site, to discover that it asks for the 3 digits yet again and then send me to that parental controls screen again. 20. Go back to settings and turn off parental controls because that didn't help. 21. Hit up Google again and find a person who suggests that switching browsers might help. I'm running the most common browser with no extensions that I use for these streaming sites because they can be such a pain in the ass, but sure. 22. Fire up Firefox with uMatrix and Adblock+ and have to do the login stuff yet again, but this time the show actually plays. So to watch an hour of TV I had to spend over 30 minutes faffing about with the stupid website. It made me pine for the days of piracy when this was all so easy. I also downplayed how many times I had to do the reload dance to even get the play button to appear, going back to the start only worked about 1 time out of 3. This isn't the only time I've struggled with streaming sites. Acorn for example simply refused to stream to my home. My wife is really into British mystery series and was pretty excited about it, but we had to drop it because their website simply refused to deliver the video and their tech support was completely unhelpful.
thisisit 11mo ago
Not to mention everyone and their moms building own streaming service only to lose money, cut down the catalogue, increase prices and find that is still not enough. So now add ads in some paid tiers. With everyone needing that ad revenue and profiling data to "personalize experience" I think it is cleaner to just sail the high seas.
raxxorraxor 11mo ago
Sometimes streaming services try to "optimize my viewing experience" for several minutes. Or it doesn't like my monitor or cable setup or browser and refuses to play anything in HD. I won't try to fix this, this is not my problem. I have exactly zero moral quarrels to then just look for alternative sources and yes, some are quite easily accessible without any friction.
expedition32 11mo ago
I am sure Netflix has the numbers. Most people watch through the app that is pre installed on the TV. There's even an icon on your remote. How much easier do you want it to be?
- christoff12 11mo ago
  Easy enough to cast from my phone when I'm not in front of my own TV; e.g. at an airbnb.
AbstractH24 11mo ago
What makes sense in growth-mode and profit-mode are not the same We are seeing FAANG-era companies switch from one to the other increasingly aggressively in the post ZERP era.

jlengrand 11mo ago

Between this, the ads on paid plans, and the fragmentation of catalogues, we've come full circle.

WorldPeas 11mo ago

the difference of course being that valve /has/ to keep their customers happy because their average user is savvy at least with browsing the internet, the same can't be said of streaming consumers, many whom I know are emigres from the now-decaying cable infrastructure. Netflix knows this and squeezes their customer base, and while I would like to assume the altruism of Steam, whether by their own design or the will of the public, a solution with friction that low is all that works with that target market.

ffsm8 11mo ago

I wish there was a service like steam for videos: not subscription but high confidence purchase of video content available "forever" (even if they remove it from the purchasing options, license would remain). Personally I watch so little tv/movies that any subscription was always overpaying. I still did it for a while, because the price wasn't high enough to push me to seek out other options. I'm no longer subbing and moved on, but the right holders are seriously detached from reality if they think this is a sane business strategy

Terretta 11mo ago
> I wish there was a service like steam for videos: not subscription but high confidence purchase of video content available "forever" (even if they remove it from the purchasing options, license would remain). In general, iTunes content purchase licenses are owned in perpetuity. You do need to download the bits and have the files on hand, as (a) Apple may lose the right to re-deliver the bits to you, or (b) you may change regions (e.g., move from Australia to Canada) and find the re-download isn't available in the new region. A good deal of stories were published in 2018 about Apple revoking or removing content, but when threads are pulled, the examples generally fell into these two camps. If you had kept the content yourself, you got to keep enjoying it. > Personally I watch so little tv/movies that any subscription was always overpaying Agree there's a good chance many households could purchase their preferred shows for less than the "watch throwaway stuff" subscriptions -- and then own them. This suggests a more ideal pairing is purchasing, plus something like Pluto.
- tonyedgecombe 11mo ago
  >In general, iTunes content purchase licenses are owned in perpetuity. All my purchased music on iTunes disappeared. Luckily I had kept copies of the files.
- fragmede 11mo ago
  Or, just buy it on any platform and then feel less bad about pirating it anyway.
bryanlarsen 11mo ago
$30 for a season pass from iTunes seemed like a ridiculous price until you do the math and realize that it really isn't.

jandrese 11mo ago

This is no joke. I tried watching the latest episode of Plur1bus on Apple TV+ on my laptop and here's the steps I went through: 1. Start chrome, navigate to tv.apple.com, click on the #1 show of the day (no problem) 2. The site tells me I can sign up for the TV service that I already have instead of offering a play button. 3. I click on the "sign up" which pauses for 10 seconds then tells me I'm already subscribed why did I hit the button you idiot. 4. I back arrow to the original page, it still asks me to sign up, hit F5 a couple of times to no effect. 5. Reload tv.apple.com from the start and navigate to the page, now it finally shows a play button. 6. Hit the play button but it gives me a popup saying that I need to verify the three digits off of the back of my credit card. I enter the digits and click the next button, but nothing happens. 7. Off to Google where I learn that if that happens you can log into accounts.apple.com first to avoid it. 8. I go through the login process on apple's site, which involves pulling out my phone to scan a QR code. 9. On the Apple site I try to go to the AppleTV+ options, which requires a second QR scan on my phone because it's apparently a different account. 10. On the site I verify that it shows the ATV+ subscription is active. 11. Return to tv.apple.com and click on the show to see that it again says I need to sign up to the service. 12. Click on the sign up button again to be told that I'm already subscribed. 13. Go back and reload the page entirely again so the play button reappears. 14. Click on the play button and get asked for the three digits again. Groan. 15. This time the next button actually works (miracle!) and it loads a second page talking about parental controls with another non-working button on the bottom. 16. I close the window and click on my profile in the upper right, verify that the parental controls are off. 17. Attempt to watch again, but again get stuck doing the 3 digit verify and get stuck on the parental controls window. 18. Go back to the settings and try turning on parental controls, which requires setting a PIN and doing another account verification, but leaving them on the most permissive settings. 19. Return to the site, to discover that it asks for the 3 digits yet again and then send me to that parental controls screen again. 20. Go back to settings and turn off parental controls because that didn't help. 21. Hit up Google again and find a person who suggests that switching browsers might help. I'm running the most common browser with no extensions that I use for these streaming sites because they can be such a pain in the ass, but sure. 22. Fire up Firefox with uMatrix and Adblock+ and have to do the login stuff yet again, but this time the show actually plays. So to watch an hour of TV I had to spend over 30 minutes faffing about with the stupid website. It made me pine for the days of piracy when this was all so easy. I also downplayed how many times I had to do the reload dance to even get the play button to appear, going back to the start only worked about 1 time out of 3. This isn't the only time I've struggled with streaming sites. Acorn for example simply refused to stream to my home. My wife is really into British mystery series and was pretty excited about it, but we had to drop it because their website simply refused to deliver the video and their tech support was completely unhelpful.

thisisit 11mo ago

Not to mention everyone and their moms building own streaming service only to lose money, cut down the catalogue, increase prices and find that is still not enough. So now add ads in some paid tiers. With everyone needing that ad revenue and profiling data to "personalize experience" I think it is cleaner to just sail the high seas.

raxxorraxor 11mo ago

Sometimes streaming services try to "optimize my viewing experience" for several minutes. Or it doesn't like my monitor or cable setup or browser and refuses to play anything in HD. I won't try to fix this, this is not my problem. I have exactly zero moral quarrels to then just look for alternative sources and yes, some are quite easily accessible without any friction.

expedition32 11mo ago

I am sure Netflix has the numbers. Most people watch through the app that is pre installed on the TV. There's even an icon on your remote. How much easier do you want it to be?

christoff12 11mo ago
Easy enough to cast from my phone when I'm not in front of my own TV; e.g. at an airbnb.

AbstractH24 11mo ago

What makes sense in growth-mode and profit-mode are not the same We are seeing FAANG-era companies switch from one to the other increasingly aggressively in the post ZERP era.