3 ms·

This is the same society that was already hoarding toilet paper. There is a very strong streak of selfishness in American culture, so telling people "here's

by Arainach 11mo ago

This is the same society that was already hoarding *toilet paper*. There is a very strong streak of selfishness in American culture, so telling people "here's all the information, now be nice and don't ruin things for everyone" means that 100% of the time someone will ruin things for everyone to try to make a buck.

mhb 11mo ago
Fine. That's how he justified his actions. And maybe that produces a good short term result. The result is you lose trust and people don't believe you the next time you need them to.
- epgui 11mo ago
  You continue to willfully interpret these words as if they reflect malice or deception, even after receiving a very simple explanation. You’re doing it on purpose at this point.
- ryandrake 11mo ago
  What would you have said, in the CDC's position, with a country full of scared people who want to survive and do what's best for the community, but also with a sizable number of selfish, greedy assholes, hoarding groceries to make a buck off their neighbor, and coughing on people for the lulz, who were unfortunately capable of ruining it for everyone? You're Fauci, trying to convince assholes to do the right thing. Go:
- alamortsubite 11mo ago
  Early in the pandemic, my girlfriend paid hundreds of dollars for a respirator to use in an emergency at her job at the hospital. It was a basic Honeywell respirator, but one of the few the hospital could approve for her to use. The same respirator costs ~$40 on Amazon today. I'm an airline brat and have flown millions of miles and been in two emergency landings involving fires. If you're ever in a similar situation, you and everybody around you better hope the crew sticks to protocol rather than worrying about bruising your precious long-term trust.
  - mhb 11mo ago
    What's your point? The airline stuck to a protocol that was worked out in advance and effective. The CDC apparently had no protocol or one that Fauci threw out the window because he thought he knew better. Now when we're in a similar situation, we have a problem.
    - alamortsubite 11mo ago
      The people screaming like children during an emergency fare even worse when told the truth. It's tricky, because as you illustrate, they're incapable of accepting that working toward the benefit of the group in such a situation is the best approach to solving the problem. In case you didn't understand my point because you don't work in healthcare, PPE for people dealing with the crisis was real fucking slim.
CWuestefeld 11mo ago
No, it's not. First, it's not clear that a significant number of people were hoarding TP at all. The best info I've read suggests that the reason for shortages were changing usage patterns: people would have been pooping at work, but since they weren't going to work, they pooped at home. Thus, sales changed from bulk institutional packaging to retail consumer products. The shortage was because the pipeline for retail products emptied, and manufacturers couldn't switch gears and distribute the alternative fast enough. Second, you have the timeline wrong. On February 29, the Surgeon General told the public to stop buying masks. On March 8, Fauci told 60 Minutes "There's no reason to be walking around with a mask." Only later, during the week of March 16, 2020, toilet paper panic buying exploded. According to NCSolutions (a retail data tracker), toilet paper sales skyrocketed compared to the previous month. And as of April 19, 2020, almost half of U.S. grocery stores experienced stockouts of toilet paper at some point during the day.
- Arainach 11mo ago
  The TP hoarding was indicative of known trends, not a shocking revelation about the state of American culture. Hoarding and gouging bottled water during hurricanes, ticket scalping at arenas, high frequency trading - our entire society is full of people whose first reaction to any piece of information is "how can I exploit this to take advantage of other people"?
  - CWuestefeld 11mo ago
    I think what you're saying is plausible, although I don't necessarily buy it in this particular case. I personally never expected the TP thing. But more to the point, though, let's assume your right. Is it right for our leaders to manipulate our behavior by lying to us? For me, it seems like the minute that starts happening, we're a democracy in name only. The fact that the government is "of the people" is really then just a technicality.
    - Arainach 11mo ago
      Yes, when the alternative is "our entire healthcare system is collapsing because an incredibly contagious disease infected a significant percentage of our healthcare professionals and more patients because the healthcare professionals didn't have access to PPE".

This is the same society that was already hoarding *toilet paper*. There is a very strong streak of selfishness in American culture, so telling people "here's

mhb 11mo ago

Fine. That's how he justified his actions. And maybe that produces a good short term result. The result is you lose trust and people don't believe you the next time you need them to.

epgui 11mo ago
You continue to willfully interpret these words as if they reflect malice or deception, even after receiving a very simple explanation. You’re doing it on purpose at this point.
ryandrake 11mo ago
What would you have said, in the CDC's position, with a country full of scared people who want to survive and do what's best for the community, but also with a sizable number of selfish, greedy assholes, hoarding groceries to make a buck off their neighbor, and coughing on people for the lulz, who were unfortunately capable of ruining it for everyone? You're Fauci, trying to convince assholes to do the right thing. Go:
alamortsubite 11mo ago
Early in the pandemic, my girlfriend paid hundreds of dollars for a respirator to use in an emergency at her job at the hospital. It was a basic Honeywell respirator, but one of the few the hospital could approve for her to use. The same respirator costs ~$40 on Amazon today. I'm an airline brat and have flown millions of miles and been in two emergency landings involving fires. If you're ever in a similar situation, you and everybody around you better hope the crew sticks to protocol rather than worrying about bruising your precious long-term trust.
- mhb 11mo ago
  What's your point? The airline stuck to a protocol that was worked out in advance and effective. The CDC apparently had no protocol or one that Fauci threw out the window because he thought he knew better. Now when we're in a similar situation, we have a problem.
  - alamortsubite 11mo ago
    The people screaming like children during an emergency fare even worse when told the truth. It's tricky, because as you illustrate, they're incapable of accepting that working toward the benefit of the group in such a situation is the best approach to solving the problem. In case you didn't understand my point because you don't work in healthcare, PPE for people dealing with the crisis was real fucking slim.

CWuestefeld 11mo ago

No, it's not. First, it's not clear that a significant number of people were hoarding TP at all. The best info I've read suggests that the reason for shortages were changing usage patterns: people would have been pooping at work, but since they weren't going to work, they pooped at home. Thus, sales changed from bulk institutional packaging to retail consumer products. The shortage was because the pipeline for retail products emptied, and manufacturers couldn't switch gears and distribute the alternative fast enough. Second, you have the timeline wrong. On February 29, the Surgeon General told the public to stop buying masks. On March 8, Fauci told 60 Minutes "There's no reason to be walking around with a mask." Only later, during the week of March 16, 2020, toilet paper panic buying exploded. According to NCSolutions (a retail data tracker), toilet paper sales skyrocketed compared to the previous month. And as of April 19, 2020, almost half of U.S. grocery stores experienced stockouts of toilet paper at some point during the day.

Arainach 11mo ago
The TP hoarding was indicative of known trends, not a shocking revelation about the state of American culture. Hoarding and gouging bottled water during hurricanes, ticket scalping at arenas, high frequency trading - our entire society is full of people whose first reaction to any piece of information is "how can I exploit this to take advantage of other people"?
- CWuestefeld 11mo ago
  I think what you're saying is plausible, although I don't necessarily buy it in this particular case. I personally never expected the TP thing. But more to the point, though, let's assume your right. Is it right for our leaders to manipulate our behavior by lying to us? For me, it seems like the minute that starts happening, we're a democracy in name only. The fact that the government is "of the people" is really then just a technicality.
  - Arainach 11mo ago
    Yes, when the alternative is "our entire healthcare system is collapsing because an incredibly contagious disease infected a significant percentage of our healthcare professionals and more patients because the healthcare professionals didn't have access to PPE".