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> By measuring it as a race, it becomes a race, and now the goal is the metric. It becomes a race when you start seeing it as a race :) One can just... ignore

by squigz 11mo ago

> By measuring it as a race, it becomes a race, and now the goal is the metric. It becomes a race when you start seeing it as a race :) One can just... ignore the leaderboard

Waterluvian 11mo ago
That’s also completely true and something I often say about gaming. You don’t like achievements? Just don’t do them. Your enjoyment shouldn’t be a function of how others interact with the product.
- Almondsetat 11mo ago
  "Just ignore it" doesn't work, psychologically.
  - squigz 11mo ago
    Lots of people play games while ignoring the achievements. Many people do - well, did - AoC while ignoring the leaderboard.
  - arlcode 11mo ago
    I never, in all the years of participating in AoC did take a look at the global leaderboard. Even before LLMs I knew it was filled with with results faster then you can blink. So some of us, from gut feeling the vast majority, it was always just for fun. Usually I spent at least until March to finish as much as I did in every year.
  - mlhpdx 11mo ago
    Oh, i’m quite sure it does. In fact, it’s a central thing in so much of psychology. The only difference is how you get there. Some people can just ignore and others take more effort.
  - Mountain_Skies 11mo ago
    I stopped staying up until midnight for the new problem set to be released and instead would do them in the afternoon. Even though I could compare my time to the leaderboard, simply not having the possibility of being on the board removed most of the comparison anxiety.
m000 11mo ago
I disagree. Having a leaderboard also leaks into the puzzle design. So the experience is different, even if you choose to ignore the leaderboard as a participant.
- orphea 11mo ago
  > Having a leaderboard also leaks into the puzzle design. Is it your opinion? Can you give an example? Or did Eric say that?
amiga386 11mo ago
I've ignored the leaderboard for its entire existence, as the puzzles release at something like 4AM-5AM in my timezone; there's no point getting up 4 hours early, or staying awake 4 hours after bedtime, for some points on the internet. Instead, getting gold stars for solving the puzzles is incentive enough, and can be done as a relaxing thing in the morning. No matter what you do, as the puzzles get harder, you won't solve them in a day (or even a lifetime) if you don't come up with good algorithms/methods/heuristics.

by squigz 11mo ago

> By measuring it as a race, it becomes a race, and now the goal is the metric. It becomes a race when you start seeing it as a race :) One can just... ignore the leaderboard

Waterluvian 11mo ago

That’s also completely true and something I often say about gaming. You don’t like achievements? Just don’t do them. Your enjoyment shouldn’t be a function of how others interact with the product.

Almondsetat 11mo ago
"Just ignore it" doesn't work, psychologically.
- squigz 11mo ago
  Lots of people play games while ignoring the achievements. Many people do - well, did - AoC while ignoring the leaderboard.
- arlcode 11mo ago
  I never, in all the years of participating in AoC did take a look at the global leaderboard. Even before LLMs I knew it was filled with with results faster then you can blink. So some of us, from gut feeling the vast majority, it was always just for fun. Usually I spent at least until March to finish as much as I did in every year.
- mlhpdx 11mo ago
  Oh, i’m quite sure it does. In fact, it’s a central thing in so much of psychology. The only difference is how you get there. Some people can just ignore and others take more effort.
- Mountain_Skies 11mo ago
  I stopped staying up until midnight for the new problem set to be released and instead would do them in the afternoon. Even though I could compare my time to the leaderboard, simply not having the possibility of being on the board removed most of the comparison anxiety.

m000 11mo ago

I disagree. Having a leaderboard also leaks into the puzzle design. So the experience is different, even if you choose to ignore the leaderboard as a participant.

orphea 11mo ago
> Having a leaderboard also leaks into the puzzle design. Is it your opinion? Can you give an example? Or did Eric say that?

amiga386 11mo ago

I've ignored the leaderboard for its entire existence, as the puzzles release at something like 4AM-5AM in my timezone; there's no point getting up 4 hours early, or staying awake 4 hours after bedtime, for some points on the internet. Instead, getting gold stars for solving the puzzles is incentive enough, and can be done as a relaxing thing in the morning. No matter what you do, as the puzzles get harder, you won't solve them in a day (or even a lifetime) if you don't come up with good algorithms/methods/heuristics.