3 ms·

LFP chemistries are approaching ~$50/kWh, and CATL's sodium chemistry is supposed to be ~$40/kWh (per CATL); soon it will be more expensive to ship the battery

LFP chemistries are approaching ~$50/kWh, and CATL's sodium chemistry is supposed to be ~$40/kWh (per CATL); soon it will be more expensive to ship the battery storage than the storage itself. "Watershed moment:" Big battery storage prices hit record low in China auction - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44504630 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44504630 - July 2025 (4 comments) IEA: The battery industry has entered a new phase - https://www.iea.org/commentaries/the-battery-industry-has-entered-a-new-phase https://www.iea.org/commentaries/the-battery-industry-has-en... - March 5th, 2025 Naxtra Battery Breakthrough & Dual-Power Architecture: CATL Pioneers the Multi-Power Era - https://www.catl.com/en/news/6401.html https://www.catl.com/en/news/6401.html - April 21st, 2025 China Already Makes as Many Batteries as the Entire World Wants - https://about.bnef.com/insights/clean-transport/china-already-makes-as-many-batteries-as-the-entire-world-wants/ https://about.bnef.com/insights/clean-transport/china-alread... - April 19th, 2024

kragen 1y ago
Currently "Sodium Battery Cell" is priced at US$50–70/kWh on the Shanghai Metals Market, which gives every appearance of being a real thing: https://www.metal.com/en/markets/43 https://www.metal.com/en/markets/43. They list LFP batteries currently at US$38–52/kWh: https://www.metal.com/en/markets/42 https://www.metal.com/en/markets/42 I think you may be dramatically overestimating how much container shipping costs.
- kragen 1y ago
  ("Shanghai Metals Market" is reportedly a consultancy which provides price data, not a market.)
sagarm 1y ago
Sodium batteries have significantly lower round-trip efficiency, so they have to be cheaper to win against LFP.
- torginus 1y ago
  That's because of the huge range of voltages in the charge curve - resistive losses in wiring scale with the square of current. When the voltage drops, the current needs to increase for the same power. If you can accept low power/current output (which EVs cant, but homes can), this isn't so bad.

kragen 1y ago

Currently "Sodium Battery Cell" is priced at US$50–70/kWh on the Shanghai Metals Market, which gives every appearance of being a real thing: https://www.metal.com/en/markets/43 https://www.metal.com/en/markets/43. They list LFP batteries currently at US$38–52/kWh: https://www.metal.com/en/markets/42 https://www.metal.com/en/markets/42 I think you may be dramatically overestimating how much container shipping costs.

kragen 1y ago
("Shanghai Metals Market" is reportedly a consultancy which provides price data, not a market.)

sagarm 1y ago

Sodium batteries have significantly lower round-trip efficiency, so they have to be cheaper to win against LFP.

torginus 1y ago
That's because of the huge range of voltages in the charge curve - resistive losses in wiring scale with the square of current. When the voltage drops, the current needs to increase for the same power. If you can accept low power/current output (which EVs cant, but homes can), this isn't so bad.