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The whole point of the crypto market is decentralization. So who do you want to act?

by slashdave 11mo ago

wmf 11mo ago
The whole point of the government is to ban harmful externalities like crypto speculation.
- christophilus 11mo ago
  That’s not the point of the government.
- jMyles 11mo ago
  I think there's a real concern that giving governments (particularly imperialist governments with the ability to project massive force both domestically and in foreign affairs) the power to criminalize voluntary economic activity tends to entrench wealth and power rather than to lubricate mobility. Moreover, while the government can have a fairly significant impact on Wall St., ForEx, and on interest rates and worldwide financial markets (though in each of these cases, it seems that despite perhaps well-intentioned regulations, the norms and fraud, abuse, and predatory instruments), there are even worst second-order effects when huge governments attempt to meddle in areas where they can exert relatively little control, as exemplified by drug prohibition for example. It's not obvious what banning crypto speculation might have - it will surely make crypto (and speculative crypto instruments) more valuable in some markets due to the smuggling risk - is that likely to be assistive to whomever you're trying to help?
  - JumpCrisscross 11mo ago
    > real concern that giving governments...the power to criminalize voluntary economic activity tends to entrench wealth and power rather than to lubricate mobility Uh, sure. But this isn't a real political phenomenon. When concerns arise around power and wealth entrenchment, the solution has never been to reduce the state's power to regulate the economy.
    - jMyles 11mo ago
      > When concerns arise around power and wealth entrenchment, the solution has never been to reduce the state's power to regulate the economy. I'm not sure why you believe that. For example, The fall of the Soviet Union - in some ways the most significant economic restructuring of the 20th century - was precisely that.
      - JumpCrisscross 11mo ago
        Fair enough. (Granted, not well read on that event.)
    - wmf 11mo ago
      “People of the same trade seldom meet together, even for merriment and diversion, but the conversation ends in a conspiracy against the public, or in some contrivance to raise prices.” — Adam Smith
- Bender 11mo ago
  It was. Governments either fell behind on crypto or were in on it. [1][2] The laws for the physical equivalents were applied in the early 19th century. It is repeating all over again. [1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZpqreZlmHGU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZpqreZlmHGU [video][7 mins] [2] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_o3nZHzCwA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_o3nZHzCwA [video][4 mins]
zerosizedweasle 11mo ago
I mean this less about crypto directly and more about the current state of the economy and society. The K economy with the top living in over the top decadence while below it's living day to day, barely getting by for a huge number of people. Bitcoin hoarders are just the most glaring symbol of that.

The whole point of the crypto market is decentralization. So who do you want to act?

wmf 11mo ago

The whole point of the government is to ban harmful externalities like crypto speculation.

christophilus 11mo ago
That’s not the point of the government.
jMyles 11mo ago
I think there's a real concern that giving governments (particularly imperialist governments with the ability to project massive force both domestically and in foreign affairs) the power to criminalize voluntary economic activity tends to entrench wealth and power rather than to lubricate mobility. Moreover, while the government can have a fairly significant impact on Wall St., ForEx, and on interest rates and worldwide financial markets (though in each of these cases, it seems that despite perhaps well-intentioned regulations, the norms and fraud, abuse, and predatory instruments), there are even worst second-order effects when huge governments attempt to meddle in areas where they can exert relatively little control, as exemplified by drug prohibition for example. It's not obvious what banning crypto speculation might have - it will surely make crypto (and speculative crypto instruments) more valuable in some markets due to the smuggling risk - is that likely to be assistive to whomever you're trying to help?
- JumpCrisscross 11mo ago
  > real concern that giving governments...the power to criminalize voluntary economic activity tends to entrench wealth and power rather than to lubricate mobility Uh, sure. But this isn't a real political phenomenon. When concerns arise around power and wealth entrenchment, the solution has never been to reduce the state's power to regulate the economy.
  - jMyles 11mo ago
    > When concerns arise around power and wealth entrenchment, the solution has never been to reduce the state's power to regulate the economy. I'm not sure why you believe that. For example, The fall of the Soviet Union - in some ways the most significant economic restructuring of the 20th century - was precisely that.
    - JumpCrisscross 11mo ago
      Fair enough. (Granted, not well read on that event.)
  - wmf 11mo ago
    “People of the same trade seldom meet together, even for merriment and diversion, but the conversation ends in a conspiracy against the public, or in some contrivance to raise prices.” — Adam Smith
Bender 11mo ago
It was. Governments either fell behind on crypto or were in on it. [1][2] The laws for the physical equivalents were applied in the early 19th century. It is repeating all over again. [1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZpqreZlmHGU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZpqreZlmHGU [video][7 mins] [2] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_o3nZHzCwA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_o3nZHzCwA [video][4 mins]

zerosizedweasle 11mo ago

I mean this less about crypto directly and more about the current state of the economy and society. The K economy with the top living in over the top decadence while below it's living day to day, barely getting by for a huge number of people. Bitcoin hoarders are just the most glaring symbol of that.