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Do Redfin and Zillow’s suggested home prices basically do the same thing? What crosses the line into price fixing or monopolistic collusion?

tptacek 1y ago
I wonder the same thing. The essence of a collusion scheme is a commitment between counterparties not to defect. Pure information is insufficient to create such a commitment. There are other ways to distort markets besides collusion, and maybe Realpage does one of them?
- cycomanic 1y ago
  > I wonder the same thing. The essence of a collusion scheme is a commitment between counterparties not to defect. Do you have any citation that supports that? That seems an awfully narrow definition.
  - tptacek 1y ago
    Sure: just google ["price fixing" "jury instructions"] (this is a cheat code for a lot of legal arguments on HN). You'll get a lot of them!
- trevwilson 1y ago
  Part of the complaint is that RealPage actively discourages defection > While some landlords might achieve higher profits by setting lower prices than recommended by the algorithm, it appears RealPage takes extensive measures to prevent such behavior. As alleged in the DOJ complaint, RealPage pushes its software users to turn on the auto-accept setting so that price recommendations are automatically accepted. The complaint also alleges that the process of rejecting a price recommendation can be onerous. For instance, in order to reject a recommendation from AIRM software, users must provide a “business” reason for doing so, and they must do so separately for each floorplan in the building. When it is costly for software users to override algorithmic recommendations, supracompetitive prices—prices above what would occur under normal competition—can be sustained. https://bidenwhitehouse.archives.gov/cea/written-materials/2024/12/17/the-cost-of-anticompetitive-pricing-algorithms-in-rental-housing/ https://bidenwhitehouse.archives.gov/cea/written-materials/2... And the full complaint: https://www.justice.gov/archives/opa/media/1364976/dl https://www.justice.gov/archives/opa/media/1364976/dl
  - tptacek 1y ago
    Yeah, stuff like that makes sense to me! Thanks!
tylergetsay 1y ago
RealPage was setting the rents not just suggesting them

tptacek 1y ago

I wonder the same thing. The essence of a collusion scheme is a commitment between counterparties not to defect. Pure information is insufficient to create such a commitment. There are other ways to distort markets besides collusion, and maybe Realpage does one of them?

cycomanic 1y ago
> I wonder the same thing. The essence of a collusion scheme is a commitment between counterparties not to defect. Do you have any citation that supports that? That seems an awfully narrow definition.
- tptacek 1y ago
  Sure: just google ["price fixing" "jury instructions"] (this is a cheat code for a lot of legal arguments on HN). You'll get a lot of them!
trevwilson 1y ago
Part of the complaint is that RealPage actively discourages defection > While some landlords might achieve higher profits by setting lower prices than recommended by the algorithm, it appears RealPage takes extensive measures to prevent such behavior. As alleged in the DOJ complaint, RealPage pushes its software users to turn on the auto-accept setting so that price recommendations are automatically accepted. The complaint also alleges that the process of rejecting a price recommendation can be onerous. For instance, in order to reject a recommendation from AIRM software, users must provide a “business” reason for doing so, and they must do so separately for each floorplan in the building. When it is costly for software users to override algorithmic recommendations, supracompetitive prices—prices above what would occur under normal competition—can be sustained. https://bidenwhitehouse.archives.gov/cea/written-materials/2024/12/17/the-cost-of-anticompetitive-pricing-algorithms-in-rental-housing/ https://bidenwhitehouse.archives.gov/cea/written-materials/2... And the full complaint: https://www.justice.gov/archives/opa/media/1364976/dl https://www.justice.gov/archives/opa/media/1364976/dl
- tptacek 1y ago
  Yeah, stuff like that makes sense to me! Thanks!

tylergetsay 1y ago

RealPage was setting the rents not just suggesting them