3 ms·

You mean... just like the Nazis did in 1939-1942? Their immoral-mass-murder really ramped up when they couldn't achieve their desired rate/expense of the immor

by Terr_ 1y ago

You mean... just like the Nazis did in 1939-1942? Their immoral-mass-murder really ramped up when they couldn't achieve their desired rate/expense of the immoral-mass-incarceration and immoral-mass-exiling they were already doing. Even if your statement was correct--it isn't, ask the victims in CECOT--it isn't reassuring or exculpatory: "Don't worry guys, we may have spent 11 months speed-running years of the Nazi trajectory, but don't worry, we're stopping at only this much of the cruelty. I promise, for realsies this time. Double pinky-swear."

cinntaile 1y ago
By all means link to any proof that the people being detained are being murdered?
- Terr_ 1y ago
  > lowly murdered in a concentration camp [...] link to any proof I explicitly mentioned the people renditioned to "CECOT", as well as two other respondents telling you about "El Salvador", stop playing dumb.
  - cinntaile 1y ago
    I'm not playing dumb, I'm asking for sources. It's not that hard to link to articles that support your claims, the burden of proof is on you. CECOT is a prison, are you saying regular people are being deported to a prison? If they are criminals that's a different story of course. I mean actual crimes to be clear, I don't count being illegal in the US.
    - Terr_ 1y ago
      I'm exasperated, because you felt confident "correcting" other people about US "deportations" in 2025, while being oddly unaware of months of major controversies and a complete departure from anything resembling "normal" immigration function. > CECOT is a prison, are you saying regular people are being deported to a prison? Yes! Yes! That is exactly what they did! 1. The Trump administration claimed we were somehow in a state of invasion by a crime gang from Venezuela and that somehow that allowed him to use Alien Enemies Act of 1798. A law last-used for the notorious Japanese Internment Camps during World War 2. [0] 2. The administration declared a bunch of Venezuelans as "gang members", with no charges nor trial, including several who at the time had legal status to be here, often based on nothing but "too many tattoos I don't recognize." [1] 3. They renditioned those people to a different country (El Salvador) and directly into a prison "for terrorists" (CECOT) and paid the local dictator to do it. [2][3] 4. They tried to move so fast that no judges could react, and still ended up violating court-orders to not transfer people into El Salvador, and then claimed they had no power or responsibility to fix it. (Even though they were paying US tax dollars to El Salvador to keep it going.) So yeah, kinda a big deal, and I trust this is more than enough for you to answer other questions with your own web-searches. __________ [0] https://apnews.com/article/trump-alien-enemies-act-venezuela-tren-de-aragua-103919f71db9a9e7a9a3de1028585483 https://apnews.com/article/trump-alien-enemies-act-venezuela... [1] https://www.npr.org/2025/03/31/nx-s1-5345832/advocates-say-flawed-checklist-dhs-venezuelans-for-deportation-under-alien-enemies-act https://www.npr.org/2025/03/31/nx-s1-5345832/advocates-say-f... [2] https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/what-to-know-about-the-el-salvador-mega-prison-where-trump-sent-hundreds-of-immigrants https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/what-to-know-about-the-el... [3] https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-paid-el-salvador-cecot-nayib-bukele-b2824075.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politic... [4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deportation_of_Kilmar_Abrego_Garcia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deportation_of_Kilmar_Abrego_G... [5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_2025_American_deportations_of_Venezuelans https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_2025_American_deportatio...
      - cinntaile 1y ago
        > I'm exasperated, because you felt confident "correcting" other people about US "deportations" in 2025 I still very confident about my original claim that this is not even close to people being sent to German concentration camps to be (slowly) murdered. You (or anyone else that responded to me) have provided zero proof of that happening. I do appreciate you taking the time to provide sources for your claims, thank you for that. I agree that better, more concrete proof is needed before deporting suspects to a prison. While a point system probably catches people that have managed to evade law enforcement and that should be in jail, there is also a bigger chance of regular people getting caught up.
        Y-bar 1y ago
        If the only difference is the lack of active murdering happening at the concentration camps, then that is hardly a defence against the claim that the current situation is similar to what my family faced 80 years ago. You do not need to carry water for those who seek to emulate past atrocities.
        cinntaile 1y ago
        > The group arrested and delivered to the Nazi authorities 8,000–9,000 Jews. Most of them were deported to Westerbork concentration camp and later shipped to and murdered in Sobibor and other German extermination camps. In my opinion that is a very big difference. Most people that are deported don't end up in a prison either, they are returned to their home countries.
        Y-bar 1y ago
        I see no rational way your opinion matches the reality on the ground. Can you provide any evidence that most of the people deported against their will and without due process and put into detention centres (nee concentration camps) considered the destination their home country.

by Terr_ 1y ago

cinntaile 1y ago

By all means link to any proof that the people being detained are being murdered?

Terr_ 1y ago
> lowly murdered in a concentration camp [...] link to any proof I explicitly mentioned the people renditioned to "CECOT", as well as two other respondents telling you about "El Salvador", stop playing dumb.
- cinntaile 1y ago
  I'm not playing dumb, I'm asking for sources. It's not that hard to link to articles that support your claims, the burden of proof is on you. CECOT is a prison, are you saying regular people are being deported to a prison? If they are criminals that's a different story of course. I mean actual crimes to be clear, I don't count being illegal in the US.
  - Terr_ 1y ago
    I'm exasperated, because you felt confident "correcting" other people about US "deportations" in 2025, while being oddly unaware of months of major controversies and a complete departure from anything resembling "normal" immigration function. > CECOT is a prison, are you saying regular people are being deported to a prison? Yes! Yes! That is exactly what they did! 1. The Trump administration claimed we were somehow in a state of invasion by a crime gang from Venezuela and that somehow that allowed him to use Alien Enemies Act of 1798. A law last-used for the notorious Japanese Internment Camps during World War 2. [0] 2. The administration declared a bunch of Venezuelans as "gang members", with no charges nor trial, including several who at the time had legal status to be here, often based on nothing but "too many tattoos I don't recognize." [1] 3. They renditioned those people to a different country (El Salvador) and directly into a prison "for terrorists" (CECOT) and paid the local dictator to do it. [2][3] 4. They tried to move so fast that no judges could react, and still ended up violating court-orders to not transfer people into El Salvador, and then claimed they had no power or responsibility to fix it. (Even though they were paying US tax dollars to El Salvador to keep it going.) So yeah, kinda a big deal, and I trust this is more than enough for you to answer other questions with your own web-searches. __________ [0] https://apnews.com/article/trump-alien-enemies-act-venezuela-tren-de-aragua-103919f71db9a9e7a9a3de1028585483 https://apnews.com/article/trump-alien-enemies-act-venezuela... [1] https://www.npr.org/2025/03/31/nx-s1-5345832/advocates-say-flawed-checklist-dhs-venezuelans-for-deportation-under-alien-enemies-act https://www.npr.org/2025/03/31/nx-s1-5345832/advocates-say-f... [2] https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/what-to-know-about-the-el-salvador-mega-prison-where-trump-sent-hundreds-of-immigrants https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/what-to-know-about-the-el... [3] https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-paid-el-salvador-cecot-nayib-bukele-b2824075.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politic... [4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deportation_of_Kilmar_Abrego_Garcia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deportation_of_Kilmar_Abrego_G... [5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_2025_American_deportations_of_Venezuelans https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_2025_American_deportatio...
    - cinntaile 1y ago
      > I'm exasperated, because you felt confident "correcting" other people about US "deportations" in 2025 I still very confident about my original claim that this is not even close to people being sent to German concentration camps to be (slowly) murdered. You (or anyone else that responded to me) have provided zero proof of that happening. I do appreciate you taking the time to provide sources for your claims, thank you for that. I agree that better, more concrete proof is needed before deporting suspects to a prison. While a point system probably catches people that have managed to evade law enforcement and that should be in jail, there is also a bigger chance of regular people getting caught up.
      - Y-bar 1y ago
        If the only difference is the lack of active murdering happening at the concentration camps, then that is hardly a defence against the claim that the current situation is similar to what my family faced 80 years ago. You do not need to carry water for those who seek to emulate past atrocities.
        cinntaile 1y ago
        > The group arrested and delivered to the Nazi authorities 8,000–9,000 Jews. Most of them were deported to Westerbork concentration camp and later shipped to and murdered in Sobibor and other German extermination camps. In my opinion that is a very big difference. Most people that are deported don't end up in a prison either, they are returned to their home countries.
        Y-bar 1y ago
        I see no rational way your opinion matches the reality on the ground. Can you provide any evidence that most of the people deported against their will and without due process and put into detention centres (nee concentration camps) considered the destination their home country.