6 ms·

The phrase below is worth the read: > giving creative workers more rights without addressing their market power is like giving your bullied kid more lunch mone

by neves 11mo ago

The phrase below is worth the read: > giving creative workers more rights without addressing their market power is like giving your bullied kid more lunch money. There isn't an amount of lunch money you can give that kid that will buy them lunch – you're just enriching the bullies

skybrian 11mo ago
Misleading phrases like this are why I dislike Doctorow. Just before that he tries to sell us on the idea that there are no alternatives when actually there are. For example, you don’t have to publish a book through the Big Five. There are many large and small independent publishers, and some authors have had good luck with self-publishing. I do think copyright law needs reform, but don’t trust Doctorow to explain it properly.
- badlibrarian 11mo ago
  His book "Why None Of My Books Are Available On Audible: And why Amazon owes me $3,218.55" captures the soul, heart, nuance (and grammar) that he repeatedly brings to these issues. He once sat in his basement for an entire month "playing the DRM off" his record collection. Resulting in twice compressed 128k MP3s and innumerable blog posts.
  - chimeracoder 11mo ago
    > He once sat in his basement for an entire month "playing the DRM off" his record collection What are you referring to here?
    - badlibrarian 11mo ago
      He set up two computers and manually played low-res DRM-protected MP3 files out of one and into the other for weeks, documenting the process on BoingBoing. He touted this not only as freedom but "preservation."
      - chimeracoder 11mo ago
        > He set up two computers and manually played low-res DRM-protected MP3 files out of one and into the other for weeks, documenting the process on BoingBoing. He touted this not only as freedom but "preservation." I see. When I hear "record collection" I think of vinyl records, so I was quite confused how DRM was relevant there.
    - jandrese 11mo ago
      Sounds like the analog hole. You play DRM material out the audio port and at the same time capture the input of that and re-encode in a non-DRM format.
- cholantesh 11mo ago
  Why is it misleading? The fact that alternatives exist doesn't mean that they're any good .
  - MichaelZuo 11mo ago
    There are plenty of fine, even higher quality and credibility, publishers out there. In fact even a mediocre university press likely has higher standards, in just about every conceivable quality aspect, than even the best imprints of the big 5.
    - Taek 11mo ago
      Yes but do the books make more money and get more distribution? Quality is not the critical factor here
      - MichaelZuo 11mo ago
        Good or bad seems like its about quality?
        cholantesh 11mo ago
        Yes, of the publishing method at giving authors ROI. This should be pretty clear from the context.
        MichaelZuo 11mo ago
        Giving authors ROI? Why would anyone, excluding authors, even want low quality books to have any ROI?
  - xhkkffbf 11mo ago
    It's true that the alternatives may not be good, but if so it suggests that maybe publishing is a business that requires certain behavior. I think the best thing that Doctorow could do is set up his own publishing business and show the big companies the right way to do it. If he's right, he'll get the best new talent and quickly succeed. But I'm guessing he'll discover what the major companies know: the consumer is fickle, developing a new book/movie/song is expensive, and only a few hits pay for the rest.
- shadowgovt 11mo ago
  > some authors have had good luck with self-publishing Indeed. What are the relative statistics on authors who have managed to bootstrap themselves vs. authors who make a comfortable living through the Big Five?
  - Asparagirl 11mo ago
    It’s not common, but it does happen. Andy Weir, author of “The Martian” and “Project Hail Mary”, originally gave his work away for free online on his website. He only self-published to Kindle (for the lowest possible price setting, 99 cents) because some of his fans didn’t know how or didn’t want to manually install his home-rolled ePubs on their devices, and begged him for the Amazon/Kindle distribution.
    - kevin_thibedeau 11mo ago
      Hugh Howey is a similar case.
  - xoxxala 11mo ago
    According to this survey: "The median income of full-time self-published authors in 2022 was $12,800 from books and $15,000 total from all author-related activities. Full-time self-published authors who had been publishing since at least 2018 reported a median income of $24,000 compared to $13,700 in 2018, a 76 percent increase." Traditionally published commercial authors made about $10,000 more. https://authorsguild.org/news/key-takeaways-from-2023-author-income-survey/ https://authorsguild.org/news/key-takeaways-from-2023-author...
- wrsh07 11mo ago
  And what alternatives existed for Wolf in the 80s? What value were publishers providing? Like many industries, book publishers integrated: editing, production, marketing, and distribution. They may have also helped with licensing. Would _Who Censored Roger Rabbit_ have been the success it was with a different publisher? These counterfactuals are hard to prove! (Look at the discussions this year around k pop demon hunters - how much credit does Netflix get for growing an objectively good film's audience? Reasonable people debate this!) The big publishers do provide utility, but there's also an incredible asymmetry (they have trivially made many more book deals than any of their authors)
  - echelon 11mo ago
    You don't need to tie yourself to distributor control if you catch fire and maintain your rights. It's never been easier to build your audience and personal brand. VivziePop with Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss was able to do this on YouTube and then ink deals with Amazon and merch retailers (where the real money is). Her shows alone rake in over $100m and the merch significantly more. Glitch with Murder Drones and Amazing Digital Circus did the same. And they've stolen a lot of high profile folks from Disney for Knights of Guinevere and upcoming shows. Psychic Pebbles did it and how has an Adult Swim show. Joel Haver, lots of others... This is basically what George Lucas was able to engineer with his 20th Century Fox deal to maintain merch rights. But it's even better for creators today.
    - wrsh07 11mo ago
      It feels like you're not responding to my actual point, so let me repeat my first sentence: > And what alternatives existed for Wolf in the 80s?
      - echelon 11mo ago
        Really? It isn't obvious? > The big publishers do provide utility, but there's also an incredible asymmetry (they have trivially made many more book deals than any of their authors) Literally doesn't matter in today's meta for people making music, video, or games. A substack or podcast following will do the same for authors. It's not that this isn't hard. I'd argue it's harder to get noticed today now that everyone can make content. It's just that the power asymmetry is disappearing because you can hold onto more of your rights. Today it's about building a brand following. If you can do that, the publishers will chase you. It wasn't available for Wolf because nobody realized this strategy yet. A lack of Internet made it more difficult, but not impossible. George Lucas kind of got it. Now it's glaringly obvious. Just not easy.
- TitaRusell 11mo ago
  Artists can put their big boy pants on and negotiate better deals instead of crying about them retroactively.
- huslage 11mo ago
  He describes what he sees as a monopsony. That is not misleading. You can have lots of options and still be stuck in this monopsonistic (sp?) world that controls your rights and your financial future.
- munificent 11mo ago
  You're correct that you no longer need to go through one of the big five publishers to get your book in front of readers. But Doctorow also says: > or just one company that controls all the ebooks and audiobooks And this is largely true. I don't think there's any viable path for self-publishing success right now that doesn't go through Amazon.
- mold_aid 11mo ago
  >There are many large and small independent publishers Are there many small press distributors? How's SPD doing these days?
raldi 11mo ago
This is the problem with basic income if you don’t also increase the housing supply: landlords will just raise rents and soak it all up.
- benmanns 11mo ago
  It does, however, make providing housing more profitable, which, on the margins, will drive more landlords and home builders into the market, decreasing long term costs (relative to a straight 100% increase relative to the basic income). So you might send everyone $100 per month and costs go up $100 per month, until supply chains shift towards supplying lower income humans with more goods and services than they used to get, at which point costs will decrease (from the $100 increase). With enough forewarning, suppliers could anticipate the increased demand and prepare for it.
  - raldi 11mo ago
    Not if desirable places restrict zoning in a way that prevents more housing from being legal to build.
    - falcor84 11mo ago
      A major factor in what makes places more desirable is access to jobs. In the case of full UBI, it will be easier to: stay unemployed, negotiate a remote work contract or launch a new venture from anywhere, so I expect that we'll see people spread out a lot more.
    - triceratops 11mo ago
      No need to stay in a "desirable place" (read: place with jobs) if you have UBI.
  - chimeracoder 11mo ago
    > It does, however, make providing housing more profitable, which, on the margins, will drive more landlords and home builders into the market, decreasing long term costs Landlords are, by and large, not the ones who create new housing units, and "lack of profit potential is" also generally not the main impedance to creating new housing in most locations either.
doctorpangloss 11mo ago
haha, you probably want to replace "their" with "[media conglomerates']"

by neves 11mo ago

skybrian 11mo ago

Misleading phrases like this are why I dislike Doctorow. Just before that he tries to sell us on the idea that there are no alternatives when actually there are. For example, you don’t have to publish a book through the Big Five. There are many large and small independent publishers, and some authors have had good luck with self-publishing. I do think copyright law needs reform, but don’t trust Doctorow to explain it properly.

badlibrarian 11mo ago
His book "Why None Of My Books Are Available On Audible: And why Amazon owes me $3,218.55" captures the soul, heart, nuance (and grammar) that he repeatedly brings to these issues. He once sat in his basement for an entire month "playing the DRM off" his record collection. Resulting in twice compressed 128k MP3s and innumerable blog posts.
- chimeracoder 11mo ago
  > He once sat in his basement for an entire month "playing the DRM off" his record collection What are you referring to here?
  - badlibrarian 11mo ago
    He set up two computers and manually played low-res DRM-protected MP3 files out of one and into the other for weeks, documenting the process on BoingBoing. He touted this not only as freedom but "preservation."
    - chimeracoder 11mo ago
      > He set up two computers and manually played low-res DRM-protected MP3 files out of one and into the other for weeks, documenting the process on BoingBoing. He touted this not only as freedom but "preservation." I see. When I hear "record collection" I think of vinyl records, so I was quite confused how DRM was relevant there.
  - jandrese 11mo ago
    Sounds like the analog hole. You play DRM material out the audio port and at the same time capture the input of that and re-encode in a non-DRM format.
cholantesh 11mo ago
Why is it misleading? The fact that alternatives exist doesn't mean that they're any good .
- MichaelZuo 11mo ago
  There are plenty of fine, even higher quality and credibility, publishers out there. In fact even a mediocre university press likely has higher standards, in just about every conceivable quality aspect, than even the best imprints of the big 5.
  - Taek 11mo ago
    Yes but do the books make more money and get more distribution? Quality is not the critical factor here
    - MichaelZuo 11mo ago
      Good or bad seems like its about quality?
      - cholantesh 11mo ago
        Yes, of the publishing method at giving authors ROI. This should be pretty clear from the context.
        MichaelZuo 11mo ago
        Giving authors ROI? Why would anyone, excluding authors, even want low quality books to have any ROI?
- xhkkffbf 11mo ago
  It's true that the alternatives may not be good, but if so it suggests that maybe publishing is a business that requires certain behavior. I think the best thing that Doctorow could do is set up his own publishing business and show the big companies the right way to do it. If he's right, he'll get the best new talent and quickly succeed. But I'm guessing he'll discover what the major companies know: the consumer is fickle, developing a new book/movie/song is expensive, and only a few hits pay for the rest.
shadowgovt 11mo ago
> some authors have had good luck with self-publishing Indeed. What are the relative statistics on authors who have managed to bootstrap themselves vs. authors who make a comfortable living through the Big Five?
- Asparagirl 11mo ago
  It’s not common, but it does happen. Andy Weir, author of “The Martian” and “Project Hail Mary”, originally gave his work away for free online on his website. He only self-published to Kindle (for the lowest possible price setting, 99 cents) because some of his fans didn’t know how or didn’t want to manually install his home-rolled ePubs on their devices, and begged him for the Amazon/Kindle distribution.
  - kevin_thibedeau 11mo ago
    Hugh Howey is a similar case.
- xoxxala 11mo ago
  According to this survey: "The median income of full-time self-published authors in 2022 was $12,800 from books and $15,000 total from all author-related activities. Full-time self-published authors who had been publishing since at least 2018 reported a median income of $24,000 compared to $13,700 in 2018, a 76 percent increase." Traditionally published commercial authors made about $10,000 more. https://authorsguild.org/news/key-takeaways-from-2023-author-income-survey/ https://authorsguild.org/news/key-takeaways-from-2023-author...
wrsh07 11mo ago
And what alternatives existed for Wolf in the 80s? What value were publishers providing? Like many industries, book publishers integrated: editing, production, marketing, and distribution. They may have also helped with licensing. Would _Who Censored Roger Rabbit_ have been the success it was with a different publisher? These counterfactuals are hard to prove! (Look at the discussions this year around k pop demon hunters - how much credit does Netflix get for growing an objectively good film's audience? Reasonable people debate this!) The big publishers do provide utility, but there's also an incredible asymmetry (they have trivially made many more book deals than any of their authors)
- echelon 11mo ago
  You don't need to tie yourself to distributor control if you catch fire and maintain your rights. It's never been easier to build your audience and personal brand. VivziePop with Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss was able to do this on YouTube and then ink deals with Amazon and merch retailers (where the real money is). Her shows alone rake in over $100m and the merch significantly more. Glitch with Murder Drones and Amazing Digital Circus did the same. And they've stolen a lot of high profile folks from Disney for Knights of Guinevere and upcoming shows. Psychic Pebbles did it and how has an Adult Swim show. Joel Haver, lots of others... This is basically what George Lucas was able to engineer with his 20th Century Fox deal to maintain merch rights. But it's even better for creators today.
  - wrsh07 11mo ago
    It feels like you're not responding to my actual point, so let me repeat my first sentence: > And what alternatives existed for Wolf in the 80s?
    - echelon 11mo ago
      Really? It isn't obvious? > The big publishers do provide utility, but there's also an incredible asymmetry (they have trivially made many more book deals than any of their authors) Literally doesn't matter in today's meta for people making music, video, or games. A substack or podcast following will do the same for authors. It's not that this isn't hard. I'd argue it's harder to get noticed today now that everyone can make content. It's just that the power asymmetry is disappearing because you can hold onto more of your rights. Today it's about building a brand following. If you can do that, the publishers will chase you. It wasn't available for Wolf because nobody realized this strategy yet. A lack of Internet made it more difficult, but not impossible. George Lucas kind of got it. Now it's glaringly obvious. Just not easy.
TitaRusell 11mo ago
Artists can put their big boy pants on and negotiate better deals instead of crying about them retroactively.
huslage 11mo ago
He describes what he sees as a monopsony. That is not misleading. You can have lots of options and still be stuck in this monopsonistic (sp?) world that controls your rights and your financial future.
munificent 11mo ago
You're correct that you no longer need to go through one of the big five publishers to get your book in front of readers. But Doctorow also says: > or just one company that controls all the ebooks and audiobooks And this is largely true. I don't think there's any viable path for self-publishing success right now that doesn't go through Amazon.
mold_aid 11mo ago
>There are many large and small independent publishers Are there many small press distributors? How's SPD doing these days?

raldi 11mo ago

This is the problem with basic income if you don’t also increase the housing supply: landlords will just raise rents and soak it all up.

benmanns 11mo ago
It does, however, make providing housing more profitable, which, on the margins, will drive more landlords and home builders into the market, decreasing long term costs (relative to a straight 100% increase relative to the basic income). So you might send everyone $100 per month and costs go up $100 per month, until supply chains shift towards supplying lower income humans with more goods and services than they used to get, at which point costs will decrease (from the $100 increase). With enough forewarning, suppliers could anticipate the increased demand and prepare for it.
- raldi 11mo ago
  Not if desirable places restrict zoning in a way that prevents more housing from being legal to build.
  - falcor84 11mo ago
    A major factor in what makes places more desirable is access to jobs. In the case of full UBI, it will be easier to: stay unemployed, negotiate a remote work contract or launch a new venture from anywhere, so I expect that we'll see people spread out a lot more.
  - triceratops 11mo ago
    No need to stay in a "desirable place" (read: place with jobs) if you have UBI.
- chimeracoder 11mo ago
  > It does, however, make providing housing more profitable, which, on the margins, will drive more landlords and home builders into the market, decreasing long term costs Landlords are, by and large, not the ones who create new housing units, and "lack of profit potential is" also generally not the main impedance to creating new housing in most locations either.

doctorpangloss 11mo ago

haha, you probably want to replace "their" with "[media conglomerates']"