6 ms·

The main issue with restricting availability of 3d printers is an economic one. The potential for engineering improvements, cost savings, insanely tight develop

by ktizo 14y ago

The main issue with restricting availability of 3d printers is an economic one. The potential for engineering improvements, cost savings, insanely tight development cycles and mass bespoke manufacture-to-order would seem to strongly favour the society with the least regulation on this. Is not as though it is really going to widely cut the cost or massively increase the availability of handguns however. The economics of established mass manufacture of simple mechanical items will have an edge over 3d printing for a while yet for any items that derive negligible economic benefit from uniqueness or short runs. There is little economic benefit in 3d-printing basic guns, in the same way as there is little economic benefit in 3d-printing paperclips. People who really want guns can get them dirt cheap already. I think grips will start being 3d printed however and the existing high-end market for bespoke crafted guns will start using technology like metal laser sintering, if it doesn't already. I am just hoping that a few idiots won't manage to completely hijack the public perception of this technology, just to play the violent-paranoia politics of gun rights, when there are far more interesting uses for this tech than adding more guns to a world that already has a massive surplus of the bloody things.

Tichy 14y ago
I live in Germany and I have never held a real gun in my hands. I am not sure where to go to get one. I think there are some shops, but a gun permit might be required to buy one. Printing one at home would lower the bar, I think. Not that I need a gun, but I mean in general. What about kids, for example?
- ktizo 14y ago
  I grew up in the UK and did some cadet training, so I learned to shoot a small caliber rifle there. I also know some farmers, some professional hunters, and some folk who go on pheasant shoots so I know a few people who use guns professionally and for sport. Legal guns are pretty widespread. On the other side, there is an illegal gun market in most large cities, where prices are shockingly low. In the reports of the recent killing of police in Manchester, both guns and grenades were claimed to be being sold on the street for between £50 and £200. As for the argument about kids, if your kids have easy access to bullets, then there are already problems long before they start trying to 3d print a gun.
  - Tichy 14y ago
    Good point - I guess somehow there has to be a way to print the bullets, too... Not that I am eager for the time when everybody can print themselves a gun at home. But I guess it will happen. Also, I have no idea how to find such a black market. Perhaps asking on Twitter would work? Otherwise I can only think of silk road, the BitCoin market. Never checked it out as I don't do drugs, but perhaps they also do guns? Not that I want a gun atm, just curious out of principle. Actually I would like to have a gun in case there is some kind of apocalypse. But I don't want to have a gun around (I think statistics say that you are much more likely to be killed by a gun if you have a gun). There should be some way to hide it somewhere safe :-/
    - sbierwagen 14y ago
      Yes, I encourage you to ask where you can illegally purchase a firearm on Twitter. That will be extremely useful, at the trial.
    - ta12121 14y ago
      I think statistics say that you are much more likely to be killed by a gun if you have a gun Statistics from gun-control advocates, for what it's worth.
      - ktizo 14y ago
        I find it hardly likely that it would be lower given you would have to factor in accidental death, suicide, murders within gun owning families, etc, and on the other side there are just the situations where owning a gun actually stopped you being shot, which are obviously much much less and often end up with the other gun owner shot, so effectively reducing that number still further. It seems fairly obvious that proximity to a deadly item increases the chance of being killed by it.
        clarkm 14y ago
        Surely those who frequently encounter dangerous situations or routinely feel that their safety is at risk are much more likely to own or carry a gun (e.g. retail business owners). I'd wager that this self-selection bias skews the statistic significantly.
- condensor 14y ago
  The real problem is getting ammunition. Even if you can print a gun getting bullets will be a far bigger problem. (At least in Germany.)
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
bloat 14y ago
Think of it like pornography. It may be available cheaply at any time at the store down the street. But having it available for download in the privacy of one's own home removes a significant barrier.
- ktizo 14y ago
  But for the moment having the minus of time, material, equipment, accuracy, money, reliability, etc. Plus, people can already make guns at home using fairly simple metalworking tools that are much less likely to fail badly than using 3d printed plastic. Or you could make a crossbow or something really basic. Is not that I don't see how certain people could be drawn to this idea, but other than as a pure engineering exercise, I really don't see the practicality, even to nutcases. Admittedly, nutcases might not be looking at this completely clearly however.

by ktizo 14y ago

Tichy 14y ago

I live in Germany and I have never held a real gun in my hands. I am not sure where to go to get one. I think there are some shops, but a gun permit might be required to buy one. Printing one at home would lower the bar, I think. Not that I need a gun, but I mean in general. What about kids, for example?

ktizo 14y ago
I grew up in the UK and did some cadet training, so I learned to shoot a small caliber rifle there. I also know some farmers, some professional hunters, and some folk who go on pheasant shoots so I know a few people who use guns professionally and for sport. Legal guns are pretty widespread. On the other side, there is an illegal gun market in most large cities, where prices are shockingly low. In the reports of the recent killing of police in Manchester, both guns and grenades were claimed to be being sold on the street for between £50 and £200. As for the argument about kids, if your kids have easy access to bullets, then there are already problems long before they start trying to 3d print a gun.
- Tichy 14y ago
  Good point - I guess somehow there has to be a way to print the bullets, too... Not that I am eager for the time when everybody can print themselves a gun at home. But I guess it will happen. Also, I have no idea how to find such a black market. Perhaps asking on Twitter would work? Otherwise I can only think of silk road, the BitCoin market. Never checked it out as I don't do drugs, but perhaps they also do guns? Not that I want a gun atm, just curious out of principle. Actually I would like to have a gun in case there is some kind of apocalypse. But I don't want to have a gun around (I think statistics say that you are much more likely to be killed by a gun if you have a gun). There should be some way to hide it somewhere safe :-/
  - sbierwagen 14y ago
    Yes, I encourage you to ask where you can illegally purchase a firearm on Twitter. That will be extremely useful, at the trial.
  - ta12121 14y ago
    I think statistics say that you are much more likely to be killed by a gun if you have a gun Statistics from gun-control advocates, for what it's worth.
    - ktizo 14y ago
      I find it hardly likely that it would be lower given you would have to factor in accidental death, suicide, murders within gun owning families, etc, and on the other side there are just the situations where owning a gun actually stopped you being shot, which are obviously much much less and often end up with the other gun owner shot, so effectively reducing that number still further. It seems fairly obvious that proximity to a deadly item increases the chance of being killed by it.
      - clarkm 14y ago
        Surely those who frequently encounter dangerous situations or routinely feel that their safety is at risk are much more likely to own or carry a gun (e.g. retail business owners). I'd wager that this self-selection bias skews the statistic significantly.
condensor 14y ago
The real problem is getting ammunition. Even if you can print a gun getting bullets will be a far bigger problem. (At least in Germany.)
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]

bloat 14y ago

Think of it like pornography. It may be available cheaply at any time at the store down the street. But having it available for download in the privacy of one's own home removes a significant barrier.

ktizo 14y ago
But for the moment having the minus of time, material, equipment, accuracy, money, reliability, etc. Plus, people can already make guns at home using fairly simple metalworking tools that are much less likely to fail badly than using 3d printed plastic. Or you could make a crossbow or something really basic. Is not that I don't see how certain people could be drawn to this idea, but other than as a pure engineering exercise, I really don't see the practicality, even to nutcases. Admittedly, nutcases might not be looking at this completely clearly however.