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> Pills are for people who feel depressed but don't have something to be depressed about -- they have food, shelter, friends, opportunities to contribute and be

by drekipus 11mo ago

> Pills are for people who feel depressed but don't have something to be depressed about -- they have food, shelter, friends, opportunities to contribute and be productive, nothing traumatic has happened, but they feel hopeless anyway This warrants a whole different discussion, and I'll be down voted for it, but one that's never addressed: quality over quantity. Pills are the individuals response to a society that feeds empty food, bland sterile shelter, fake friends, and meaningless jobs. The natural human response to a lack of meaning is hopelessness, and this comes from our society. Pills helps individuals cope with continuing the meat grinder just a little while longer. I had depression, and I cured it by finding meaning and beauty in the world. I get told "if you can cure it without pills, you never really had it" yeah cool, self fullfilling prophecy in that case innit. Can't cure it, because it doesn't exist without meds. It just comes out of "nowhere" and is here to stay.

robertakarobin 11mo ago
> I cured it by finding meaning and beauty in the world. That's incredibly fortunate and I'm very jealous of you. How would you recommend one goes about finding meaning and beauty? I'm fortunate to have had lots of unique experiences and traveled to lots of unique places and still haven't found the fulfillment that you seem to. That's basically what depression is: a debilitating feeling of lack of fulfillment, without any idea of what's missing. I'm happiest when busy building and fixing things. It could be that if I was born 200 years ago into an agrarian society where day-to-day life was focused on building and fixing things to survive, then I would have felt very fulfilled and done quite well. What were gainful full-time jobs back then have been reduced to hobbies now, though: blacksmithing, cobbling, weaving, hunting, making furniture, etc. Hobbies don't fill the hole for me. Sure, a few artisans are still able to turn those into a living, but a large part of the job is marketing and the clients are largely the wealthy elite. I've enjoyed working in food service and construction but it's hard to support a family of 4 doing those. So my career has been in software engineering since that involves building and fixing and pays well, but it still doesn't fill the hole. If this sounds whiny I'm painfully aware. What right do I have to complain about feeling unfulfilled when there are real problems in the world? And that's the very essence of major depression.
- gh0stcat 11mo ago
  For what it's worth, I have dealt with pretty severe depression for most of my adult life. I am only starting to have periods of coming out when I realized that most of depressed feelings come from a place of ego. I have an identity of who I am and what I like, and I seek things in the external world which might provide meaning for me. For me, it's because I always sought value from the things around me, rather than believing that I am already enough. Every single day, I have to beat down my instincts that tell me that I am worthless and remind myself that there is more beauty in the world and it's actually absurd that I am letting society tear away from me my natural instincts to want to live and enjoy life. You have to really sit with these feelings though... like really really get to know your voice vs the internalized societal voice. I have developed "tests" that help me discern which voice is which, but it has helped a bit. Also working out and taking care of your body is a bonus, and just taking pride in like... doing things to lead a peaceful life is underrated. Hope you feel better.
  - robertakarobin 11mo ago
    I hope you can understand that this and other comments about needing to find meaning and needing to sit with inner feelings... It feels patronizing. I have spent tremendous amounts of time and energy analyzing my feelings and looking for meaningful experiences. I've sought relief in meditation, religion, therapy, yoga, travel, art, etc. Most people probably have in one way or another. It's not rocket science to know those activities may be beneficial. They undoubtedly do help some people overcome feeling depressed. But feeling depressed is different from having depression.
    - gh0stcat 11mo ago
      I'm sorry it came off that way, I really didn't intend it to be, it was actually a self call out because I actually never learned as a child to sit with my inner feelings. I attribute that to being more sensitive and probably more intelligent than my siblings and acting as a buffer for my parents and basically only ever wanting to make other people happy, I never developed an inner world like other kids do. Also I noticed... yoga, travel, art, those are still external. Even meditation can be if you approach it from a standpoint of like... one that is about forming your ego around it rather than being present... not sure if this makes sense. Like you can approach anything from a negative or place of wanting to 'fix' yourself, which ruins the experience imo. For me I would ruin things that were supposed to be fun because I would tell myself I should do this because it's good for me. That being said, there are really low days still when I will feel absolutely nothing, I will think to myself... if this psychological pain is so intense, why should I keep going? I don't have answers for that. I genuinely just have to make it through the day. I understand that with the pressures of a family and kids, it's not one of those things where you can easily tap out, medication makes sense for that. I was just trying to share how I feel because honestly for me there isn't anyone in my life who I can relate with on this deep of a level... of these feelings, and it's really alienating in itself.
N_Lens 11mo ago
I agree with your perspective but these things are on a spectrum. For very severe cases medication can be highly helpful and supportive, as they move to find their meaning and purpose. Each person’s situation is unique and I think blanket judgements are unhelpful.

robertakarobin 11mo ago

> I cured it by finding meaning and beauty in the world. That's incredibly fortunate and I'm very jealous of you. How would you recommend one goes about finding meaning and beauty? I'm fortunate to have had lots of unique experiences and traveled to lots of unique places and still haven't found the fulfillment that you seem to. That's basically what depression is: a debilitating feeling of lack of fulfillment, without any idea of what's missing. I'm happiest when busy building and fixing things. It could be that if I was born 200 years ago into an agrarian society where day-to-day life was focused on building and fixing things to survive, then I would have felt very fulfilled and done quite well. What were gainful full-time jobs back then have been reduced to hobbies now, though: blacksmithing, cobbling, weaving, hunting, making furniture, etc. Hobbies don't fill the hole for me. Sure, a few artisans are still able to turn those into a living, but a large part of the job is marketing and the clients are largely the wealthy elite. I've enjoyed working in food service and construction but it's hard to support a family of 4 doing those. So my career has been in software engineering since that involves building and fixing and pays well, but it still doesn't fill the hole. If this sounds whiny I'm painfully aware. What right do I have to complain about feeling unfulfilled when there are real problems in the world? And that's the very essence of major depression.

gh0stcat 11mo ago
For what it's worth, I have dealt with pretty severe depression for most of my adult life. I am only starting to have periods of coming out when I realized that most of depressed feelings come from a place of ego. I have an identity of who I am and what I like, and I seek things in the external world which might provide meaning for me. For me, it's because I always sought value from the things around me, rather than believing that I am already enough. Every single day, I have to beat down my instincts that tell me that I am worthless and remind myself that there is more beauty in the world and it's actually absurd that I am letting society tear away from me my natural instincts to want to live and enjoy life. You have to really sit with these feelings though... like really really get to know your voice vs the internalized societal voice. I have developed "tests" that help me discern which voice is which, but it has helped a bit. Also working out and taking care of your body is a bonus, and just taking pride in like... doing things to lead a peaceful life is underrated. Hope you feel better.
- robertakarobin 11mo ago
  I hope you can understand that this and other comments about needing to find meaning and needing to sit with inner feelings... It feels patronizing. I have spent tremendous amounts of time and energy analyzing my feelings and looking for meaningful experiences. I've sought relief in meditation, religion, therapy, yoga, travel, art, etc. Most people probably have in one way or another. It's not rocket science to know those activities may be beneficial. They undoubtedly do help some people overcome feeling depressed. But feeling depressed is different from having depression.
  - gh0stcat 11mo ago
    I'm sorry it came off that way, I really didn't intend it to be, it was actually a self call out because I actually never learned as a child to sit with my inner feelings. I attribute that to being more sensitive and probably more intelligent than my siblings and acting as a buffer for my parents and basically only ever wanting to make other people happy, I never developed an inner world like other kids do. Also I noticed... yoga, travel, art, those are still external. Even meditation can be if you approach it from a standpoint of like... one that is about forming your ego around it rather than being present... not sure if this makes sense. Like you can approach anything from a negative or place of wanting to 'fix' yourself, which ruins the experience imo. For me I would ruin things that were supposed to be fun because I would tell myself I should do this because it's good for me. That being said, there are really low days still when I will feel absolutely nothing, I will think to myself... if this psychological pain is so intense, why should I keep going? I don't have answers for that. I genuinely just have to make it through the day. I understand that with the pressures of a family and kids, it's not one of those things where you can easily tap out, medication makes sense for that. I was just trying to share how I feel because honestly for me there isn't anyone in my life who I can relate with on this deep of a level... of these feelings, and it's really alienating in itself.

N_Lens 11mo ago

I agree with your perspective but these things are on a spectrum. For very severe cases medication can be highly helpful and supportive, as they move to find their meaning and purpose. Each person’s situation is unique and I think blanket judgements are unhelpful.