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> The value of modern AI seems very hig Very useful, clearly. But valuable? In aggregate it seems clear that it is. But where does that value acrue? It seems

by worik 11mo ago

> The value of modern AI seems very hig Very useful, clearly. But valuable? In aggregate it seems clear that it is. But where does that value acrue? It seems to me the value will be thinly spread while the costs are concentrated. It does not seem possible that any conceivable business can pay for all the announced plans for developing data centres, nor energy available to power them. If AI systems can be developed to be trust worthy enough to act on their own, none so far (?), then I can see where the value could acrue, but as things stand?

mmooss 11mo ago
> It seems to me the value will be thinly spread while the costs are concentrated. Won't the value will be concentrated in the few with the scale to build competitive AIs? In a sense, costs are spread thinly across the content creators whose work has been stolen. (But of course, it is indeed incredibly concentrated in building datacenters.)
- worik 11mo ago
  > content creators whose work has been stolen. The law is an ass. Current IP laws are too restrictive, but scraping public facing websites is not theft even under those crazy laws I have no moral objection to the use of Anna's Archive to train models. A good use, if illegal. But I do recogise and condemn the hypocrisy of Meta doing it. Not surprising, just disgusting The wasting of bandwidth is annoying, so silly. We should be better organized Calling it theft is buying into the mad bad and sad IP legal thinking that has become the dominant paradigm in the West
  - mmooss 11mo ago
    In a way, I agree with your last sentence. But there is a difference, and that is power. As a simplistic hypothesis: The already-powerful and super-wealthy taking all that IP from the small content creators is theft, IMHO. The small content creators who can't afford JSTOR finding some free source for a paper, etc. is democratic, empowering, and enriches our society.
- worik 11mo ago
  > Won't the value will be concentrated in the few with the scale to build competitive AIs? No. Open AI and their ilk can sell tokens, but how much business is there in that? Trillions? If not, they're bankrupt. Dead man walking. Zombie The open and free models are very capable and getting better. If there is a breakthrough beyond transformers and neural nets that means trustworthy AI that can be agentic (does not exist, the "trustworthy" part) then it will be exponentially more valuable. But that was as likely in 2020 as in 2030. Meanwhile something like 10% of the USA electricity supply is being "committed" to datacenters and no practical plans to supply it Meanwhile the Chinese are leaping ahead and in a more community orientated open way. The cognitive dissonance is quite loud for that one!

by worik 11mo ago

mmooss 11mo ago

> It seems to me the value will be thinly spread while the costs are concentrated. Won't the value will be concentrated in the few with the scale to build competitive AIs? In a sense, costs are spread thinly across the content creators whose work has been stolen. (But of course, it is indeed incredibly concentrated in building datacenters.)

worik 11mo ago
> content creators whose work has been stolen. The law is an ass. Current IP laws are too restrictive, but scraping public facing websites is not theft even under those crazy laws I have no moral objection to the use of Anna's Archive to train models. A good use, if illegal. But I do recogise and condemn the hypocrisy of Meta doing it. Not surprising, just disgusting The wasting of bandwidth is annoying, so silly. We should be better organized Calling it theft is buying into the mad bad and sad IP legal thinking that has become the dominant paradigm in the West
- mmooss 11mo ago
  In a way, I agree with your last sentence. But there is a difference, and that is power. As a simplistic hypothesis: The already-powerful and super-wealthy taking all that IP from the small content creators is theft, IMHO. The small content creators who can't afford JSTOR finding some free source for a paper, etc. is democratic, empowering, and enriches our society.
worik 11mo ago
> Won't the value will be concentrated in the few with the scale to build competitive AIs? No. Open AI and their ilk can sell tokens, but how much business is there in that? Trillions? If not, they're bankrupt. Dead man walking. Zombie The open and free models are very capable and getting better. If there is a breakthrough beyond transformers and neural nets that means trustworthy AI that can be agentic (does not exist, the "trustworthy" part) then it will be exponentially more valuable. But that was as likely in 2020 as in 2030. Meanwhile something like 10% of the USA electricity supply is being "committed" to datacenters and no practical plans to supply it Meanwhile the Chinese are leaping ahead and in a more community orientated open way. The cognitive dissonance is quite loud for that one!