6 ms·

Does there become a point where reporting on this kind of stuff is just feeding the trolls? Ars is both giving them the reaction they want and platforming their

by Spivak 11mo ago

Does there become a point where reporting on this kind of stuff is just feeding the trolls? Ars is both giving them the reaction they want and platforming their nonsense. The government put up a poster that says vaccines bad very autism and maybe the right response is to just ignore it. This admin seems to be fueled by outrage and very loud showy public displays of basically nothing when you get down to it. Cool story RFK, anyway moving on.

squigz 11mo ago
It would be more irresponsible to ignore it than anything else. A tempered response would be better.
- Spivak 11mo ago
  But why? Do you feel the need to respond to those weirdos in the street yelling about how god hates fags and the end of days or whatever? Is anything gained by acknowledging them at all? There's plenty of real stuff this admin is doing to respond to; focusing on the performative nonsense that exists seemingly to keep them 'winning' in the news cycle to their base might just be wasting your breath.
  - squigz 11mo ago
    > Do you feel the need to respond to those weirdos in the street yelling about how god hates fags and the end of days or whatever? There's a huge difference between the seriousness of "the official disease control of the US government" saying some nonsense and "random citizens yelling in the street" doing so. > Is anything gained by acknowledging them at all? Is there anything gained by ignoring them? I'm sure it won't seem very performative to the kids who aren't vaccinated and get sick, or autistic folks who don't appreciate the correlation. > plenty of real stuff this admin is doing to respond to I'm sure we can respond to at least 2 things.
  - smackeyacky 11mo ago
    Because it normalises dangerous bullshit and that should be a line in the sand for any responsible human. You can’t dismiss it because it’s part of a much wider pattern that is fuelling the justification of other dangerous bullshit we used to suppress in the pursuit of harmony.
  - giraffe_lady 11mo ago
    This is the real stuff this admin is doing. Using the public health apparatus to discredit and dismantle one of the most successful medical projects in human history is real stuff.
  - multjoy 11mo ago
    Those weirdos on the street aren't your actual government institutions. This is 1984 territory, without hyperbole. They are rewriting what you see so that you will always have been at war with Eurasia.
triceratops 11mo ago
If people get used to ignoring government health recommendations, what happens if a responsible government comes back in power?
- frumplestlatz 11mo ago
  You’ll have to let me know when that has ever really happened. I can’t recall a single government in my lifetime that didn’t push some remarkably stupid and irresponsible nonsense. People my age probably remember the classic 90s “food pyramid” in school and on the back of sugared cereal boxes — it pushed empty carbs as the the foundation of a healthy diet.
  - viraptor 11mo ago
    There's a difference between doing something well meant, failing, and improving -vs- going back to theories already proven wrong and harmful. There's a reason we don't have the food pyramid - we're learning.
    - amscanne 11mo ago
      You don't think that the current crop of vaccine-skeptics are mostly well-intentioned and that the movement will ultimately fade-away decades down the line? It seems identical to me: soft corruption and bad science shaping government policy. Annoying and bad, but also hopefully temporary (but may do damage in the meantime). I agree that it happens with all governments. Has everyone forgotten the sea of bad science that was COVID policy? Thank god they arrested that paddle-boarder!
      - viraptor 11mo ago
        > You don't think that the current crop of vaccine-skeptics are mostly well-intentioned Well intentioned but wrong is only when you have incomplete information. Once your theory has been disproven multiple times and you still ignore it, that's not well intentioned anymore. That's just lying to yourself and others at that point.
deleted 11mo ago
[deleted]
AuthAuth 11mo ago
Consider how strange this would be for a non American to watch this change go through and no one to bat at eye. This shit is crazy and it needs to be said.
- beeforpork 11mo ago
  Well, many or even most non-Americans generally look up to America to learn. The USA are regarded as the pinnacle of world culture, industry, and commerce by the world. Even in non-western countries, and even if daemonized by certain leaders, the common people generally know that there are the greatest achievements in the USA. A few people may not do so, and may know how bad some corners are cut and how rotten some things are, but that's a minority. Also, if a powerful US politician farts, it is on all the front pages of all media outlets around the world. There's no escape, US news are pushed into all corners. And politicians in the world see that the thug model has worked quite effectively, and so strategies are taken over to do the same everywhere else, like ignoring science and instead citing 'common sense'. All this BS that's currently going on spreads into the last corners of the world as ultimately good ideas, as truths, and the thugs are role models for the world. It is not good. How to explain future to my kids? Yeah, sorry, I am also using the 'kid' argument now.
nobodywillobsrv 11mo ago
No, one should always present a path of how to explain it. This is hard. get the data. gather it.

by Spivak 11mo ago

squigz 11mo ago

It would be more irresponsible to ignore it than anything else. A tempered response would be better.

Spivak 11mo ago
But why? Do you feel the need to respond to those weirdos in the street yelling about how god hates fags and the end of days or whatever? Is anything gained by acknowledging them at all? There's plenty of real stuff this admin is doing to respond to; focusing on the performative nonsense that exists seemingly to keep them 'winning' in the news cycle to their base might just be wasting your breath.
- squigz 11mo ago
  > Do you feel the need to respond to those weirdos in the street yelling about how god hates fags and the end of days or whatever? There's a huge difference between the seriousness of "the official disease control of the US government" saying some nonsense and "random citizens yelling in the street" doing so. > Is anything gained by acknowledging them at all? Is there anything gained by ignoring them? I'm sure it won't seem very performative to the kids who aren't vaccinated and get sick, or autistic folks who don't appreciate the correlation. > plenty of real stuff this admin is doing to respond to I'm sure we can respond to at least 2 things.
- smackeyacky 11mo ago
  Because it normalises dangerous bullshit and that should be a line in the sand for any responsible human. You can’t dismiss it because it’s part of a much wider pattern that is fuelling the justification of other dangerous bullshit we used to suppress in the pursuit of harmony.
- giraffe_lady 11mo ago
  This is the real stuff this admin is doing. Using the public health apparatus to discredit and dismantle one of the most successful medical projects in human history is real stuff.
- multjoy 11mo ago
  Those weirdos on the street aren't your actual government institutions. This is 1984 territory, without hyperbole. They are rewriting what you see so that you will always have been at war with Eurasia.

triceratops 11mo ago

If people get used to ignoring government health recommendations, what happens if a responsible government comes back in power?

frumplestlatz 11mo ago
You’ll have to let me know when that has ever really happened. I can’t recall a single government in my lifetime that didn’t push some remarkably stupid and irresponsible nonsense. People my age probably remember the classic 90s “food pyramid” in school and on the back of sugared cereal boxes — it pushed empty carbs as the the foundation of a healthy diet.
- viraptor 11mo ago
  There's a difference between doing something well meant, failing, and improving -vs- going back to theories already proven wrong and harmful. There's a reason we don't have the food pyramid - we're learning.
  - amscanne 11mo ago
    You don't think that the current crop of vaccine-skeptics are mostly well-intentioned and that the movement will ultimately fade-away decades down the line? It seems identical to me: soft corruption and bad science shaping government policy. Annoying and bad, but also hopefully temporary (but may do damage in the meantime). I agree that it happens with all governments. Has everyone forgotten the sea of bad science that was COVID policy? Thank god they arrested that paddle-boarder!
    - viraptor 11mo ago
      > You don't think that the current crop of vaccine-skeptics are mostly well-intentioned Well intentioned but wrong is only when you have incomplete information. Once your theory has been disproven multiple times and you still ignore it, that's not well intentioned anymore. That's just lying to yourself and others at that point.

deleted 11mo ago

[deleted]

AuthAuth 11mo ago

Consider how strange this would be for a non American to watch this change go through and no one to bat at eye. This shit is crazy and it needs to be said.

beeforpork 11mo ago
Well, many or even most non-Americans generally look up to America to learn. The USA are regarded as the pinnacle of world culture, industry, and commerce by the world. Even in non-western countries, and even if daemonized by certain leaders, the common people generally know that there are the greatest achievements in the USA. A few people may not do so, and may know how bad some corners are cut and how rotten some things are, but that's a minority. Also, if a powerful US politician farts, it is on all the front pages of all media outlets around the world. There's no escape, US news are pushed into all corners. And politicians in the world see that the thug model has worked quite effectively, and so strategies are taken over to do the same everywhere else, like ignoring science and instead citing 'common sense'. All this BS that's currently going on spreads into the last corners of the world as ultimately good ideas, as truths, and the thugs are role models for the world. It is not good. How to explain future to my kids? Yeah, sorry, I am also using the 'kid' argument now.

nobodywillobsrv 11mo ago

No, one should always present a path of how to explain it. This is hard. get the data. gather it.