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This feels very analogous to my experience with the place. As a Black person (who absolutely loves the idea and model), it's weird. Feels very much like a "you

by jrm4 11mo ago

This feels very analogous to my experience with the place. As a Black person (who absolutely loves the idea and model), it's weird. Feels very much like a "you become what you hate situation," in my case, interacting with Black folks with whom I share probably like 97% similar views on just about everything -- and yet, (it's mild, no worries, but) I have been on the receiving end of the literal worst behavior I've ever experienced via strangers on social media. E.g. some mild doxxing, you aren't really Black etc. (And for those curious/interested/familiar, yes it was "Bad Space" aligned people)

bakugo 11mo ago
> with whom I share probably like 97% similar views on just about everything That's exactly the problem, though. Political echo chambers with no diversity of thought ultimately cultivate the expectation that everyone must agree on every topic, at all times. As soon as you dare disagree with what the majority has decided is the "correct" opinion, you will be seen as the enemy.
- jbs789 11mo ago
  I think his point is that we all have more in common as humans than differences, and yet the differences prevail, which is a shame (and unhealthy). So we make our own choices about where we spend our time, and some of us simply disconnect.
- blackqueeriroh 11mo ago
  3% variance on beliefs is way bigger than you think, and also he said “just about” everything, not everything. And you can have whatever opinion you want, but also be prepared for me to tell you that your opinion is stupid, and when you assert that a falsehood is in fact opinion instead of a lie, I will point out that facts are not opinions and opinions are not facts. Too many of y’all get this confused.
  - bakugo 11mo ago
    You seem like exactly the kind of person I was alluding to in my comment.
vasco 11mo ago
> interacting with Black folks with whom I share probably like 97% similar views on just about everything Maybe because you say things like that? In what world is people's skin color related to their views?
- meowface 11mo ago
  I don't think that's what they were trying to imply there.
  - vasco 11mo ago
    Unfortunately that's what they wrote? What other interpretation could there be?
    - rcxdude 11mo ago
      a) They used 'Black' as opposed to 'black', which often is used specifically to mean a particular culture around african-americans specifically, not just a signifier of skin tone. b) The charitable interpretation is that they are Black and that they share 97% of their views.
      - vasco 11mo ago
        Its impossible to think you agree with 97% of any group without assuming everyone from that group thinks the same way. Even people from just one country don't think the same way due to color of skin, if we were to assume the point is only about americans.
        bee_rider 11mo ago
        They didn’t say “agree with” they said “97% similar views.” This seems like a pretty informal measurement, and we don’t have much insight into what it really means.
        11mo ago
modo_mario 11mo ago
>(And for those curious/interested/familiar, yes it was "Bad Space" aligned people) What do you mean?
- jrm4 11mo ago
  You'd have to be around Mastodon to know what that means, but basically there was an effort by some Black folks there to not just create their own server but to also flag and identify racist/toxic servers etc, and anyone who fit that as they saw was put on their thing called "The Bad Space." Was it well meaning? Yes. Did it end up being childish, overblown and power-trippy? Also yes. I find that most everyone on Mastodon focuses properly, but too much on "Black people aren't much into Mastodon because of the racism," and not "Black people aren't much into Mastodon because it's boring as hell."
  - modo_mario 11mo ago
    I don't consider those types of efforts well meaning anymore. Rather than changing minds they without fail seem to attract narcissists and people utilizing victimhood like a status item or the like and that and purity spirals like a cudgel. >I find that most everyone on Mastodon focuses properly, but too much on "Black people aren't much into Mastodon because of the racism," and not "Black people aren't much into Mastodon because it's boring as hell." It's sad to say but I think black people aren't big in the tech space or similar spaces in general and not just in the US. Fosdem is one of the most pasty conventions out there in a rather international city. As an outsider looking in I think just like with the lack of women in tech it's not primarily a barrier problem. And this is a different subject but I in factthink some of the weird campaigning towards women to join has had the opposite effect (Think 'barbie and her pink laptop entering the male dominated field' type stuff just reinforcing pointlessly gendered preconceptions.)
    - jrm4 11mo ago
      Black people are emphatically absolutely big in tech in the US, just not in a lot of well known "classic" arena; way more in the business tech space. Like linkedin, not slashdot. like, the 4chan tech board is a great source of information and also a disgusting cesspool of casual racism. C'est la vie.

by jrm4 11mo ago

bakugo 11mo ago

> with whom I share probably like 97% similar views on just about everything That's exactly the problem, though. Political echo chambers with no diversity of thought ultimately cultivate the expectation that everyone must agree on every topic, at all times. As soon as you dare disagree with what the majority has decided is the "correct" opinion, you will be seen as the enemy.

jbs789 11mo ago
I think his point is that we all have more in common as humans than differences, and yet the differences prevail, which is a shame (and unhealthy). So we make our own choices about where we spend our time, and some of us simply disconnect.
blackqueeriroh 11mo ago
3% variance on beliefs is way bigger than you think, and also he said “just about” everything, not everything. And you can have whatever opinion you want, but also be prepared for me to tell you that your opinion is stupid, and when you assert that a falsehood is in fact opinion instead of a lie, I will point out that facts are not opinions and opinions are not facts. Too many of y’all get this confused.
- bakugo 11mo ago
  You seem like exactly the kind of person I was alluding to in my comment.

vasco 11mo ago

> interacting with Black folks with whom I share probably like 97% similar views on just about everything Maybe because you say things like that? In what world is people's skin color related to their views?

meowface 11mo ago
I don't think that's what they were trying to imply there.
- vasco 11mo ago
  Unfortunately that's what they wrote? What other interpretation could there be?
  - rcxdude 11mo ago
    a) They used 'Black' as opposed to 'black', which often is used specifically to mean a particular culture around african-americans specifically, not just a signifier of skin tone. b) The charitable interpretation is that they are Black and that they share 97% of their views.
    - vasco 11mo ago
      Its impossible to think you agree with 97% of any group without assuming everyone from that group thinks the same way. Even people from just one country don't think the same way due to color of skin, if we were to assume the point is only about americans.
      - bee_rider 11mo ago
        They didn’t say “agree with” they said “97% similar views.” This seems like a pretty informal measurement, and we don’t have much insight into what it really means.
        11mo ago

modo_mario 11mo ago

>(And for those curious/interested/familiar, yes it was "Bad Space" aligned people) What do you mean?

jrm4 11mo ago
You'd have to be around Mastodon to know what that means, but basically there was an effort by some Black folks there to not just create their own server but to also flag and identify racist/toxic servers etc, and anyone who fit that as they saw was put on their thing called "The Bad Space." Was it well meaning? Yes. Did it end up being childish, overblown and power-trippy? Also yes. I find that most everyone on Mastodon focuses properly, but too much on "Black people aren't much into Mastodon because of the racism," and not "Black people aren't much into Mastodon because it's boring as hell."
- modo_mario 11mo ago
  I don't consider those types of efforts well meaning anymore. Rather than changing minds they without fail seem to attract narcissists and people utilizing victimhood like a status item or the like and that and purity spirals like a cudgel. >I find that most everyone on Mastodon focuses properly, but too much on "Black people aren't much into Mastodon because of the racism," and not "Black people aren't much into Mastodon because it's boring as hell." It's sad to say but I think black people aren't big in the tech space or similar spaces in general and not just in the US. Fosdem is one of the most pasty conventions out there in a rather international city. As an outsider looking in I think just like with the lack of women in tech it's not primarily a barrier problem. And this is a different subject but I in factthink some of the weird campaigning towards women to join has had the opposite effect (Think 'barbie and her pink laptop entering the male dominated field' type stuff just reinforcing pointlessly gendered preconceptions.)
  - jrm4 11mo ago
    Black people are emphatically absolutely big in tech in the US, just not in a lot of well known "classic" arena; way more in the business tech space. Like linkedin, not slashdot. like, the 4chan tech board is a great source of information and also a disgusting cesspool of casual racism. C'est la vie.