5 ms·

"With Bitcoin you do not get government bailouts" -- yeah maybe not yet? Is it beyond belief that a government with leadership deeply invested in crypto currenc

by dahinds 11mo ago

"With Bitcoin you do not get government bailouts" -- yeah maybe not yet? Is it beyond belief that a government with leadership deeply invested in crypto currencies might take action if something super disruptive happens?

KetoManx64 11mo ago
Possible. But Bitcoin is hard capped at 21 million coins. The government can peint more paper money to bail a company out if it makes stupid decisions, but they cannot print more Bitcoin. This will devalue the paper currency even more and also increase the value of Bitcoin. Bitcoin is called a hedge against inflation for a reason.
- robocat 11mo ago
  At present BTC is usually denominated in USD. Until I start to see BTC used as the cross-rate I'm sceptical. Presuming it occurs, it would occur relatively quickly?
  - KetoManx64 11mo ago
    Square just pushed out the ability to pay in Bitcoin to millions of retailers this last week: https://www.forbes.com/sites/digital-assets/2025/11/11/bitcoin-is-a-step-closer-to-being-money-with-square-bitcoin-launch/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/digital-assets/2025/11/11/bitco... We're right on the corner of that very day that you're talking about.
    - arcticbull 11mo ago
      That's yet another example of denominated in USD, and converted to BTC at the last second. Obviously, because of the insane volatility.
- kibwen 11mo ago
  > But Bitcoin is hard capped at 21 million coins Bitcoin is not an immutable law of nature. If the coin minting cap is reached, all that needs to happen is for miners to start running a fork with a higher cap. Tada, more coins conjured out of the ether, just like all the previous ones. If you want enforced scarcity, you need to be tied to something physically scarce.
  - rcxdude 11mo ago
    It would require the market to move as well to consider those new coins worth anything, though. Miners do not have enough control of the chain to make such changes on their own.
  - KetoManx64 11mo ago
    The miners can totally start mining a fork, in fact they can start doing so today, but it doesn't matter because nobody will use their fork and then they will have lost out on their hundreds of millions of dollars of investments into mining equipment. The node operators play just as critical of a role in Bitcoin as the miners.
    - rcxdude 11mo ago
      It's not the node operators either, it's the people who transact on the chain that determine the value of the coins. The miners can disrupt the ability of the chain to transact to some degree, but they can't make people think their fork is worthwhile (why anyone still thinks BTC has much long-term value is beyond me, but...).
      - KetoManx64 11mo ago
        Yes! Thank for that correction.
    - mindcandy 11mo ago
      > in fact they can start doing so today In fact they already have. There are 10s of thousands of forks of Bitcoin. Only a handful ever got significant attention. And, the original is still much larger than all of the forks combined.
- majormajor 11mo ago
  You say "devalue the paper currency even more" but if bitcoin holders need to be bailed in any given country aren't we talking about a scenario where bitcoin is the thing that's lost a bunch of value? Some sort of "it turns out shady bitcoin holders or companies were artificially pumping up the value in a sneaky way and then someone connected the dots" situation? First thing that comes to mind off the top of my head as a US-Govt option here would be something like: bail out US people/companies of bitcoin holdings in USD in conjunction with banning bitcoin in the US going forward. So that would be quite the string of events at that point for non-US bitcoin holders: first a crash that caused all these US bitcoin holders to go screaming to the government for help. Then the overnight removal of a huge chunk of the bitcoin market, coupled with either a firesale to comply with the ban or US gov seizure of a bunch of the coins, which will push the price lower for anyone who hasn't sold yet since their buyer pool is now much lower.
  - KetoManx64 11mo ago
    I wouldn't be surprised if the US government doesn't attempt something just like this in the next 3-5 years. There are a lot of people fleeing the very inflationary US dollar for BTC. I think at this point it would be too late though. There are too many countries, individuals and corporations around the world that own BTC for it to be successful. There was a long term holder that dumped 24,000BTC onto the market in August and the price dropped down about 5% for maybe half a day before recovering, and it's not going to be long until other countries follow El Salvador's lead and invite Bitcoin owners to live there tax free. If the USA bans Bitcoin there will be a massive brain drain of very intelligent people who will just move to those countries.
    - CPLX 11mo ago
      > If the USA bans Bitcoin there will be a massive brain drain of very intelligent people who will just move to those countries. Is that really possible? Can we do this today?
      - pavlov 11mo ago
        It sounds rather wonderful, all the very intelligent crypto people voluntarily deporting themselves to El Salvador. Everybody who ever created a meme coin should also be put on the same plane, voluntary or not.
- fmbb 11mo ago
  The government can bail Bitcoin owners out by buying a lot of Bitcoin and holding it, or even burning the wallets.

by dahinds 11mo ago

KetoManx64 11mo ago

Possible. But Bitcoin is hard capped at 21 million coins. The government can peint more paper money to bail a company out if it makes stupid decisions, but they cannot print more Bitcoin. This will devalue the paper currency even more and also increase the value of Bitcoin. Bitcoin is called a hedge against inflation for a reason.

robocat 11mo ago
At present BTC is usually denominated in USD. Until I start to see BTC used as the cross-rate I'm sceptical. Presuming it occurs, it would occur relatively quickly?
- KetoManx64 11mo ago
  Square just pushed out the ability to pay in Bitcoin to millions of retailers this last week: https://www.forbes.com/sites/digital-assets/2025/11/11/bitcoin-is-a-step-closer-to-being-money-with-square-bitcoin-launch/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/digital-assets/2025/11/11/bitco... We're right on the corner of that very day that you're talking about.
  - arcticbull 11mo ago
    That's yet another example of denominated in USD, and converted to BTC at the last second. Obviously, because of the insane volatility.
kibwen 11mo ago
> But Bitcoin is hard capped at 21 million coins Bitcoin is not an immutable law of nature. If the coin minting cap is reached, all that needs to happen is for miners to start running a fork with a higher cap. Tada, more coins conjured out of the ether, just like all the previous ones. If you want enforced scarcity, you need to be tied to something physically scarce.
- rcxdude 11mo ago
  It would require the market to move as well to consider those new coins worth anything, though. Miners do not have enough control of the chain to make such changes on their own.
- KetoManx64 11mo ago
  The miners can totally start mining a fork, in fact they can start doing so today, but it doesn't matter because nobody will use their fork and then they will have lost out on their hundreds of millions of dollars of investments into mining equipment. The node operators play just as critical of a role in Bitcoin as the miners.
  - rcxdude 11mo ago
    It's not the node operators either, it's the people who transact on the chain that determine the value of the coins. The miners can disrupt the ability of the chain to transact to some degree, but they can't make people think their fork is worthwhile (why anyone still thinks BTC has much long-term value is beyond me, but...).
    - KetoManx64 11mo ago
      Yes! Thank for that correction.
  - mindcandy 11mo ago
    > in fact they can start doing so today In fact they already have. There are 10s of thousands of forks of Bitcoin. Only a handful ever got significant attention. And, the original is still much larger than all of the forks combined.
majormajor 11mo ago
You say "devalue the paper currency even more" but if bitcoin holders need to be bailed in any given country aren't we talking about a scenario where bitcoin is the thing that's lost a bunch of value? Some sort of "it turns out shady bitcoin holders or companies were artificially pumping up the value in a sneaky way and then someone connected the dots" situation? First thing that comes to mind off the top of my head as a US-Govt option here would be something like: bail out US people/companies of bitcoin holdings in USD in conjunction with banning bitcoin in the US going forward. So that would be quite the string of events at that point for non-US bitcoin holders: first a crash that caused all these US bitcoin holders to go screaming to the government for help. Then the overnight removal of a huge chunk of the bitcoin market, coupled with either a firesale to comply with the ban or US gov seizure of a bunch of the coins, which will push the price lower for anyone who hasn't sold yet since their buyer pool is now much lower.
- KetoManx64 11mo ago
  I wouldn't be surprised if the US government doesn't attempt something just like this in the next 3-5 years. There are a lot of people fleeing the very inflationary US dollar for BTC. I think at this point it would be too late though. There are too many countries, individuals and corporations around the world that own BTC for it to be successful. There was a long term holder that dumped 24,000BTC onto the market in August and the price dropped down about 5% for maybe half a day before recovering, and it's not going to be long until other countries follow El Salvador's lead and invite Bitcoin owners to live there tax free. If the USA bans Bitcoin there will be a massive brain drain of very intelligent people who will just move to those countries.
  - CPLX 11mo ago
    > If the USA bans Bitcoin there will be a massive brain drain of very intelligent people who will just move to those countries. Is that really possible? Can we do this today?
    - pavlov 11mo ago
      It sounds rather wonderful, all the very intelligent crypto people voluntarily deporting themselves to El Salvador. Everybody who ever created a meme coin should also be put on the same plane, voluntary or not.
fmbb 11mo ago
The government can bail Bitcoin owners out by buying a lot of Bitcoin and holding it, or even burning the wallets.