4 ms·

Electronic parking brakes are so stupid. They offer no real value and eliminate the ability to safely use a secondary brake in an emergency.

foofoo12 1y ago
Not to mention the cool handbrake turn when you're a teenager.
- Daneel_ 1y ago
  As I once heard: when the lever pops, the panties drop. Not my classiest comment, but I figured someone would get a chuckle from it.
mannykannot 1y ago
I had not thought much about it until now, but when I did, I guessed it was a cost-cutting move, as it seems to piggyback on equipment needed for other features (principally ABS). Now that you've mentioned it, I'm wondering if the auto manufacturers needed to get a bunch of regulators to drop secondary/emergency braking requirements in order to do this?
- giantg2 1y ago
  My guess is they implemented whoever they felt like and the regulations only require a "parking" brake, but don't talk about implementation.
jesprenj 1y ago
On my peugeot 5008, pressing the electronic parkong brake button for more than cca 500ms while driving fully engages all brakes of the car (not only rear ones), but ABS remains functional. So in an emergency, one could theoretically still use this as an emergency brake. Although I agree that it's quite dumb, because it of course wouldn't work in case of computer/electric failure. What a shame indeed.
- tremon 1y ago
  That sounds quite useless to me. I've never been in an emergency where I could afford a 500ms delay before engaging the brakes, and also had ample opportunity and presence of mind to keep my finger uninterrupted on a dashboard button.
- giantg2 1y ago
  It also wouldn't work if you lost hydraulics.
  - cartoonworld 1y ago
    Thats the same case with all brakes in use more or less. Also modern brakes have two hydraulic systems, in the case that one of the loops (front or rear) breaks there should be sufficient pressure to apply the brakes still. Sometimes its front/rear and sometimes it is diagonal, but it should still do the emergency trick.
    - giantg2 1y ago
      Regular parking/emergency brakes use a cable instead of hydraulics.
      - cartoonworld 1y ago
        They also don't really stop a moving car, its a parking brake. Just wanted to add, a EPB used for emergency stop in his scenario is just using the regular stopping brakes, its not an emergency brake either.
        giantg2 1y ago
        "They also don't really stop a moving car, it's a parking brake." This is false. Have you ever tried it? I can say from experience they will stop a moving car.
        1y ago
PunchyHamster 1y ago
The value is not having to put mechanical linkage all the way to the back. I'd think if it would be cheaper to leave it manual they would. But I'm appalled at more and more choices that make cars more error-prone in emergency. I'd never want brake by wire car. Even if the mechanical reliability would be the same, one coding error and brakes are gone
- potato3732842 1y ago
  They're not worried about a $20+installation cable that they can copy-paste from the last car. An EV "needs" the electric actuator to replicate the park position in a conventional automatic transmission. The motor has no mechanical brake so the parking brake is automatically applied via software. Once you can do that why run the cable? There's som minor addition value in sharing the system with ICE models that don't need it and programming them to cycle the system from time to time so that they don't rust up and stop working like cables are inclined to in automatic equipped cars.
  - giantg2 1y ago
    "Once you can do that why run the cable?" In case of electronic/hydraulic failure when driving. If you want to replace the park position of a transmission, then they should do that with something that actually mimics that. You could use a sprocket and pawl on the motor output shaft.
  - rootusrootus 1y ago
    Some EVs, not all. My Lightning has a parking pawl.
  - userbinator 1y ago
    An EV "needs" the electric actuator to replicate the park position in a conventional automatic transmission. Noteworthy fact: most early automatic transmissions had no park position. Like a manual, you put them in neutral and set the parking brake instead.
- giantg2 1y ago
1970-01-01 1y ago
What other mechanism would you use to park an EV then??
- giantg2 1y ago
  The same sort of mechanism that transmissions use today - a sprocket and pawl or similar somewhere between the motor and wheels.
  - 1970-01-01 1y ago
    So now you're building a transmission just to park? Seems like you're not sure how that actually works.
    - BenjiWiebe 1y ago
      Adding a sprocket to a rotating shaft is not the same as adding a transmission.
Too 1y ago
Automatic disengage when accelerating and automatic engage when parking means means one less thing to think about. Just get in the car, put in gear and go. EVs also have very powerful motor braking that can get the car to a stop if the hydraulic brakes are busted.
- dzhiurgis 1y ago
  This. I don't think about parking brakes. Get into parking spot, open doors - car engages parking brake itself. It's nuts all cars don't do this yet.

foofoo12 1y ago

Not to mention the cool handbrake turn when you're a teenager.

Daneel_ 1y ago
As I once heard: when the lever pops, the panties drop. Not my classiest comment, but I figured someone would get a chuckle from it.

mannykannot 1y ago

I had not thought much about it until now, but when I did, I guessed it was a cost-cutting move, as it seems to piggyback on equipment needed for other features (principally ABS). Now that you've mentioned it, I'm wondering if the auto manufacturers needed to get a bunch of regulators to drop secondary/emergency braking requirements in order to do this?

giantg2 1y ago
My guess is they implemented whoever they felt like and the regulations only require a "parking" brake, but don't talk about implementation.

jesprenj 1y ago

On my peugeot 5008, pressing the electronic parkong brake button for more than cca 500ms while driving fully engages all brakes of the car (not only rear ones), but ABS remains functional. So in an emergency, one could theoretically still use this as an emergency brake. Although I agree that it's quite dumb, because it of course wouldn't work in case of computer/electric failure. What a shame indeed.

tremon 1y ago
That sounds quite useless to me. I've never been in an emergency where I could afford a 500ms delay before engaging the brakes, and also had ample opportunity and presence of mind to keep my finger uninterrupted on a dashboard button.
giantg2 1y ago
It also wouldn't work if you lost hydraulics.
- cartoonworld 1y ago
  Thats the same case with all brakes in use more or less. Also modern brakes have two hydraulic systems, in the case that one of the loops (front or rear) breaks there should be sufficient pressure to apply the brakes still. Sometimes its front/rear and sometimes it is diagonal, but it should still do the emergency trick.
  - giantg2 1y ago
    Regular parking/emergency brakes use a cable instead of hydraulics.
    - cartoonworld 1y ago
      They also don't really stop a moving car, its a parking brake. Just wanted to add, a EPB used for emergency stop in his scenario is just using the regular stopping brakes, its not an emergency brake either.
      - giantg2 1y ago
        "They also don't really stop a moving car, it's a parking brake." This is false. Have you ever tried it? I can say from experience they will stop a moving car.
        1y ago

PunchyHamster 1y ago

The value is not having to put mechanical linkage all the way to the back. I'd think if it would be cheaper to leave it manual they would. But I'm appalled at more and more choices that make cars more error-prone in emergency. I'd never want brake by wire car. Even if the mechanical reliability would be the same, one coding error and brakes are gone

potato3732842 1y ago
They're not worried about a $20+installation cable that they can copy-paste from the last car. An EV "needs" the electric actuator to replicate the park position in a conventional automatic transmission. The motor has no mechanical brake so the parking brake is automatically applied via software. Once you can do that why run the cable? There's som minor addition value in sharing the system with ICE models that don't need it and programming them to cycle the system from time to time so that they don't rust up and stop working like cables are inclined to in automatic equipped cars.
- giantg2 1y ago
  "Once you can do that why run the cable?" In case of electronic/hydraulic failure when driving. If you want to replace the park position of a transmission, then they should do that with something that actually mimics that. You could use a sprocket and pawl on the motor output shaft.
- rootusrootus 1y ago
  Some EVs, not all. My Lightning has a parking pawl.
- userbinator 1y ago
  An EV "needs" the electric actuator to replicate the park position in a conventional automatic transmission. Noteworthy fact: most early automatic transmissions had no park position. Like a manual, you put them in neutral and set the parking brake instead.
giantg2 1y ago

1970-01-01 1y ago

What other mechanism would you use to park an EV then??

giantg2 1y ago
The same sort of mechanism that transmissions use today - a sprocket and pawl or similar somewhere between the motor and wheels.
- 1970-01-01 1y ago
  So now you're building a transmission just to park? Seems like you're not sure how that actually works.
  - BenjiWiebe 1y ago
    Adding a sprocket to a rotating shaft is not the same as adding a transmission.

Too 1y ago

Automatic disengage when accelerating and automatic engage when parking means means one less thing to think about. Just get in the car, put in gear and go. EVs also have very powerful motor braking that can get the car to a stop if the hydraulic brakes are busted.

dzhiurgis 1y ago
This. I don't think about parking brakes. Get into parking spot, open doors - car engages parking brake itself. It's nuts all cars don't do this yet.