3 ms·

You can listen to what men are saying, or continue to suppress and label their speech as "bad faith" or otherwise. When men are not heard they simply seek othe

by ryandv 11mo ago

You can listen to what men are saying, or continue to suppress and label their speech as "bad faith" or otherwise. When men are not heard they simply seek other audiences and other avenues. It is the incentive structures that will tell them where to go.

btilly 11mo ago
This message is never going to go over well among those that the young men are reacting against. The fact that they don't get listened to causes them to double down into extremism. Our current levels of extremism have put us in danger of sliding into becoming a totalitarian state. That risk will not lessen unless both sides recognize that extremism itself is the danger. Underneath the anger, angry people are often hurt people. Labeling them enemies and hurting them further certainly feels good in the moment. But in the long run it is counterproductive.
- ryandv 11mo ago
  You are right of course, but given the subject matter I thought it was worth a try. It turned out not to be.
immibis 11mo ago
When I grew up, my dad always yelled at me every day before school about how climate change is my fault because of my white male privilege and I need to chow down ze bugs or I'm a racist. That didn't happen. I just made that up. Was that also your first instinct upon reading it - that I made it up? But I see men saying things like this happened to them, and that is my first instinct: it didn't happen and they made it up. Am I supposed to stop doing that? Am I supposed to believe them? Listening to real problems is good - are you saying I should listen to obvious trolls as well? That is what "bad faith" means - it's a euphemism for "obviously trolling". Perhaps you even think I'm lying when I say I see people saying things like this online - but if that's the case, that means you're part of the same problem you cite, since you're not listening what I'm saying. Can you propose a solution to all this?
- ryandv 11mo ago
  Thanks for sharing your thoughts. "<3"
kjkjadksj 11mo ago
What exactly are people not hearing? Say the quiet part out loud already. It is the fact they can no longer openly shit on women and minorities and homosexuals and trans people that they have issues with. The fact that being white and having a white name are not enough to be granted a favorable job. That is all that is changing these days. Now consider what it says about the men who are kicking and screaming about this.
- ryandv 11mo ago
  > What exactly are people not hearing? Say the quiet part out loud already. I thought I was fairly explicit right here, in this comment [0]. Shall I continue and post my 93 Theses? There are no hidden messages here. If you think there are I suggest you seek a licensed psychiatrist. > It is the fact they can no longer openly shit on women and minorities and homosexuals and trans people that they have issues with. On the contrary - browsing through my comment history will reveal that I openly shit on women, homosexuals, trans people, people I have issues with, and more. > The fact that being white and having a white name are not enough to be granted a favorable job. Not sure what this has to do with anything - I am an ethnic minority, but thank you for assuming my race and ethnicity. I invite you to assume my sex and gender next. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45917800 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45917800
- throwawaypath 11mo ago
  What exactly are people not hearing? Say the quiet part out loud already. It is the fact they can no longer openly shit on men and majorities and heterosexuals and normal people that they have issues with. The fact that being non-white and having a non-white name are not enough to be granted a favorable job. That is all that is changing these days. Now consider what it says about the women who are kicking and screaming about this.

by ryandv 11mo ago

btilly 11mo ago

This message is never going to go over well among those that the young men are reacting against. The fact that they don't get listened to causes them to double down into extremism. Our current levels of extremism have put us in danger of sliding into becoming a totalitarian state. That risk will not lessen unless both sides recognize that extremism itself is the danger. Underneath the anger, angry people are often hurt people. Labeling them enemies and hurting them further certainly feels good in the moment. But in the long run it is counterproductive.

ryandv 11mo ago
You are right of course, but given the subject matter I thought it was worth a try. It turned out not to be.

immibis 11mo ago

When I grew up, my dad always yelled at me every day before school about how climate change is my fault because of my white male privilege and I need to chow down ze bugs or I'm a racist. That didn't happen. I just made that up. Was that also your first instinct upon reading it - that I made it up? But I see men saying things like this happened to them, and that is my first instinct: it didn't happen and they made it up. Am I supposed to stop doing that? Am I supposed to believe them? Listening to real problems is good - are you saying I should listen to obvious trolls as well? That is what "bad faith" means - it's a euphemism for "obviously trolling". Perhaps you even think I'm lying when I say I see people saying things like this online - but if that's the case, that means you're part of the same problem you cite, since you're not listening what I'm saying. Can you propose a solution to all this?

ryandv 11mo ago
Thanks for sharing your thoughts. "<3"

kjkjadksj 11mo ago

What exactly are people not hearing? Say the quiet part out loud already. It is the fact they can no longer openly shit on women and minorities and homosexuals and trans people that they have issues with. The fact that being white and having a white name are not enough to be granted a favorable job. That is all that is changing these days. Now consider what it says about the men who are kicking and screaming about this.

ryandv 11mo ago
> What exactly are people not hearing? Say the quiet part out loud already. I thought I was fairly explicit right here, in this comment [0]. Shall I continue and post my 93 Theses? There are no hidden messages here. If you think there are I suggest you seek a licensed psychiatrist. > It is the fact they can no longer openly shit on women and minorities and homosexuals and trans people that they have issues with. On the contrary - browsing through my comment history will reveal that I openly shit on women, homosexuals, trans people, people I have issues with, and more. > The fact that being white and having a white name are not enough to be granted a favorable job. Not sure what this has to do with anything - I am an ethnic minority, but thank you for assuming my race and ethnicity. I invite you to assume my sex and gender next. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45917800 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45917800
throwawaypath 11mo ago
What exactly are people not hearing? Say the quiet part out loud already. It is the fact they can no longer openly shit on men and majorities and heterosexuals and normal people that they have issues with. The fact that being non-white and having a non-white name are not enough to be granted a favorable job. That is all that is changing these days. Now consider what it says about the women who are kicking and screaming about this.