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You don't understand the logic of "there are some crime problems we're willing to accept more intrusions to solve than other crime problems?" Seems like someth
by estearum 1y ago
You don't understand the logic of "there are some crime problems we're willing to accept more intrusions to solve than other crime problems?"
Seems like something virtually everyone believes, and all that changes is where they draw the line of balance between intrusion and safety.
- karmakaze 1y agoThe point is that there is no actual line. There's the premise which then collects the data. Then the data can be used for other purposes--no line prevents this.
- Tadpole9181 1y agoWeird. There's an article right here showing them turning off the cameras when the line was crossed and now that data can't be used the way they don't want. So clearly we're allowed more nuanced takes than you think.
- notyourwork 1y agoReactivity isn’t proactively protecting what you belief. It’s reacting to public outcry for the original premise.
- brookst 1y agoAre you proposing everyone make the optimal decision in advance, when outcomes are all speculative, and just be sure to get it right so there’s no need to learn and adapt to circumstances?
- notyourwork 1y agoI propose we stop letting government do things that are revenue based and pretend they are “in our best interests”.
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- giantg2 1y ago"There's an article right here showing them turning off the cameras when the line was crossed and now that data can't be used the way they don't want." Not exactly true. This happened after the arrests and won't affect those arrests. This also doesn't prevent ICE from installing and using Flock cameras on federal properties (like the post offices). I would also bet that they could still comb the existing data if they wanted to, hence the shutdown of the cameras on the fear that they can't keep the data safe.
- estearum 1y agoAll of which further confirms that there is in fact a line.
- Wistar 1y agoThe Redmond City Council made a recommendation to turn off the cameras on Nov 3rd, two days before the ICE arrests. There had been local concern aired the week prior about feds/ICE possibly accessing Flock camera data. I think it was on its way to being shut down but the ICE activity perhaps hastened it. https://www.nwprogressive.org/weblog/2025/11/a-preliminary-victory-for-privacy-redmond-police-department-to-disable-flock-automated-license-plate-readers-for-the-time-being.html https://www.nwprogressive.org/weblog/2025/11/a-preliminary-v...
- dpoloncsak 1y ago"They did the thing and the public got mad so clearly they won't do it again"
- expedition32 1y agoI would hope so because no we are obviously not turning back the clock to a time when cameras did not exist. Most people kind of find surveillance cameras reassuring. They're installing them in my mom's apartment complex after a vote.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- mulmen 1y agoReally depends who owns the footage. I’m installing cameras on my house but the NVR is local-only.
- AngryData 1y agoDid they also vote on giving the federal government or any govermental authorities access to that footage? Did they ask if they want all the neighbors to be able to watch any of it? Did they ask if they would give it to cops to use against residents? Because im willing to bet a lot of answers would change when they knew the answer to those questions.
- QuantumFunnel 1y ago"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
- dwattttt 1y ago"Those (the Penn family) who would give up essential Liberty (money & power), to purchase a little temporary Safety (a veto over a taxation dispute, trying to raise money from the Penn family), deserve neither Liberty (said money & power) nor Safety (the defense that said taxed money would've bought from the present French & Indian wars)"
- zahlman 1y agoThe context of the original quote doesn't prevent others from finding it more generally applicable or well-put.
- potato3732842 1y agoIt's kind of funny if you think about it. Franklin spent so many years arguing for liberty, low taxes and limited government that when he tried to argue in favor of taxation and federal power he unintentionally still argued in favor of the former.
- Terr_ 1y agoA lot of our political discussions and systems these days are warped by a failure to understand the ways that state-versus-federal differences have changed over time. Even today, it's not necessarily hypocritical for someone to argue that states should do more X while the federal government should do less X.
- dwattttt 1y agoIt doesn't, but at that point you're not referencing what a person meant, you're saying something they didn't intend with their words. You might as well make your point with your words, instead of misleadingly quoting someone else.
- gmueckl 1y agoThe problem here is that the law and order politicians world wide pretty consistently follow a pattern that starts by demanding surveillance tools to fight very serious crimes and those crimes only. Once they get that, they eventually start another campaign to allow use of the tools that they now have access to for less serious crimes. After a few cycles of this, you get a massive erosion of citizen rights. This is called "Salamitaktik" in Germany.
- ryoshoe 1y agoFor anyone else interested in reading more: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salami_slicing_tactics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salami_slicing_tactics
- potato3732842 1y ago>they eventually start another campaign to allow use of the tools that they now have access to for less serious crimes. Don't forget the part where the useful idiots cheer because "I hate street racers and package thieves" or "I hate cults and drugs" depending on the decade
- SilverElfin 1y agoPeople aren’t useful idiots for wanting to avoid being victims of crime. They’re rational. Stop trivializing the big negative impact street racing and theft have on people.
- potato3732842 1y agoThey are if they use it to rationalize giving government effectively arbitrary power over them for barely any decrease of crime that victimizes them. Stop acting like they're using the dragnet in the interest of the citizenry. They're not.
- pseudalopex 1y agoThis new technology will improve existing procedures. How can you oppose it? This new procedure will use existing technologies. How can you oppose it?