4 ms·

There is significantly more spectrum available for wifi in the 6ghz band than in the 5ghz band, so even if we moved everything off of 5ghz and ignored the atten

There is significantly more spectrum available for wifi in the 6ghz band than in the 5ghz band, so even if we moved everything off of 5ghz and ignored the attenuation benefits of 6ghz, we'd still have significantly less congestion on 6ghz than 5ghz wifi. In my apartment, my laptop can see ~50 wifi networks, we need some spectrum elbow-room to spread that out. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_WLAN_channels https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_WLAN_channels

friendzis 11mo ago
"significantly" is 50%, but still nowhere near 1 channel per network even if all networks cooperated.
- throw0101d 11mo ago
  > "significantly" is 50%, but still nowhere near 1 channel per network even if all networks cooperated. 5Ghz has 500Mhz worth of total bandwidth, while 6Ghz has (in US/CA, and hopefully in EU eventually) 1200Mhz. That's over double. 6Ghz has more 160Mhz channels (7) than 5Ghz has 80Mhz channels (6).
  - friendzis 11mo ago
    5Ghz has 9 non-SRD 40Mhz channels (4 x 80MHz), while 6GHz has 12 (3 x 160MHz).
  - PunchyHamster 11mo ago
    so in reality you're 1 channel up over 6GHz becasue people are not buying wifi6 router to stay on 80MHz channel
    - craftkiller 11mo ago
      They are if they're in an urban environment (which is 80% of the population of the United States). Maximizing your channel width only makes sense in suburban/rural areas. You can get a much more reliable connection by using a smaller channel width. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45542444 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45542444
      - throw0101d 11mo ago
        > They are if they're in an urban environment (which is 80% of the population of the United States). About 40% of the US population lives in a coastal county: * https://coast.noaa.gov/states/fast-facts/economics-and-demographics.html https://coast.noaa.gov/states/fast-facts/economics-and-demog... About two-thirds (66%) of the US population lives with-in 100 miles (150km) of the border: * https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/your-rights-border-zone https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/your-rights-bord... The US population is more concentrated than many people realize.
    - jdewerd 11mo ago
      Completely independent of bandwidth, higher frequencies also fall off faster. That's bad if you are trying to cover max space but good if you are trying to avoid noisy neighbors.
    - throw0101d 11mo ago
      > so in reality you're 1 channel up over 6GHz becasue people are not buying wifi6 router to stay on 80MHz channel In reality, a 1x1 80Mhz connection gives you a 600 Mbps PHY rate: * https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000005725/wireless/legacy-intel-wireless-products.html https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000... * https://superuser.com/questions/1619079/what-is-the-maximum-connection-speed-and-channel-width-on-each-2-4-ghz-and-5-ghz https://superuser.com/questions/1619079/what-is-the-maximum-... Even if you halve that, how many online activities are going to make use of that bandwidth? And if you have a 2x2 client, you double it anyways. A 1x1 40Mhz using 802.11ax will give you a max PHY of 287Mbps. How many activities use >100 Mbps, especially continuously? Off the top of my head: certainly downloading a new game or software updates can eat up those bits, and photo/video editing or creation (local NAS or uploading) it might be useful; are there any other activities that use that? As I commented elsewhere: it would be great if residential Wifi devices defaulted to 40 MHz.
matt-p 11mo ago
There is arguably less? 6Ghz is considered 5945 to 6425, 5Ghz allows far more if you include outdoor and fixed wifi.
- amsterdorn 11mo ago
  This isn't true, 6GHz uses 5.925 to 7.125.
  - matt-p 11mo ago
    WiFi uses the above, for now.

friendzis 11mo ago

"significantly" is 50%, but still nowhere near 1 channel per network even if all networks cooperated.

throw0101d 11mo ago
> "significantly" is 50%, but still nowhere near 1 channel per network even if all networks cooperated. 5Ghz has 500Mhz worth of total bandwidth, while 6Ghz has (in US/CA, and hopefully in EU eventually) 1200Mhz. That's over double. 6Ghz has more 160Mhz channels (7) than 5Ghz has 80Mhz channels (6).
- friendzis 11mo ago
  5Ghz has 9 non-SRD 40Mhz channels (4 x 80MHz), while 6GHz has 12 (3 x 160MHz).
- PunchyHamster 11mo ago
  so in reality you're 1 channel up over 6GHz becasue people are not buying wifi6 router to stay on 80MHz channel
  - craftkiller 11mo ago
    They are if they're in an urban environment (which is 80% of the population of the United States). Maximizing your channel width only makes sense in suburban/rural areas. You can get a much more reliable connection by using a smaller channel width. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45542444 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45542444
    - throw0101d 11mo ago
      > They are if they're in an urban environment (which is 80% of the population of the United States). About 40% of the US population lives in a coastal county: * https://coast.noaa.gov/states/fast-facts/economics-and-demographics.html https://coast.noaa.gov/states/fast-facts/economics-and-demog... About two-thirds (66%) of the US population lives with-in 100 miles (150km) of the border: * https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/your-rights-border-zone https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/your-rights-bord... The US population is more concentrated than many people realize.
  - jdewerd 11mo ago
    Completely independent of bandwidth, higher frequencies also fall off faster. That's bad if you are trying to cover max space but good if you are trying to avoid noisy neighbors.
  - throw0101d 11mo ago
    > so in reality you're 1 channel up over 6GHz becasue people are not buying wifi6 router to stay on 80MHz channel In reality, a 1x1 80Mhz connection gives you a 600 Mbps PHY rate: * https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000005725/wireless/legacy-intel-wireless-products.html https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000... * https://superuser.com/questions/1619079/what-is-the-maximum-connection-speed-and-channel-width-on-each-2-4-ghz-and-5-ghz https://superuser.com/questions/1619079/what-is-the-maximum-... Even if you halve that, how many online activities are going to make use of that bandwidth? And if you have a 2x2 client, you double it anyways. A 1x1 40Mhz using 802.11ax will give you a max PHY of 287Mbps. How many activities use >100 Mbps, especially continuously? Off the top of my head: certainly downloading a new game or software updates can eat up those bits, and photo/video editing or creation (local NAS or uploading) it might be useful; are there any other activities that use that? As I commented elsewhere: it would be great if residential Wifi devices defaulted to 40 MHz.

matt-p 11mo ago

There is arguably less? 6Ghz is considered 5945 to 6425, 5Ghz allows far more if you include outdoor and fixed wifi.

amsterdorn 11mo ago
This isn't true, 6GHz uses 5.925 to 7.125.
- matt-p 11mo ago
  WiFi uses the above, for now.