5 ms·

I don’t see how Thiel is in any way libertarian. He seems to support neoreactionaries like Curtis Yarvin that actually argue for a return to monarchy, and Trump

by _yb2s 11mo ago

I don’t see how Thiel is in any way libertarian. He seems to support neoreactionaries like Curtis Yarvin that actually argue for a return to monarchy, and Trump, the most illiberal authoritarian prominent politician in modern US history. He seems like he wants to effectively eliminate freedom, human rights, and liberty entirely- seems like the furthest possible position from libertarianism?

mindslight 11mo ago
It's the fake rightist "Libertarianism" of freedom for me, but not for thee. The main freedom he desires is the freedom to coerce other people. This is patently not libertarianism, but that doesn't stop these powermongers from cloaking themselves in the label to distract from their goals while assuaging their own egos. Similar to how they use religion.
- nis0s 11mo ago
  In a word, horseshoe theory. If you’re on the extreme sides of the political spectrum, you’re essentially authoritarian, even if you don’t necessarily “feel” that you are authoritarian.
  - tmtvl 11mo ago
    The political spectrum isn't left to right, despite some places seeming that way. The political spectrum is both progressive to conservative and libertarian to authoritarian. Although that's a lie and it isn't as simple as that either, because it doesn't work for differentiating green conservatives from regular conservatives, for example.
    - mindslight 11mo ago
      Green conservatives are still talking about climate change as their main issue. Regular conservatives just want these fucking fascists deposed, in prison, and their deplorable enablers back to being ashamed ^_^
    - _yb2s 11mo ago
      I’d argue the opposite- most people don’t think of politics in terms of goals, philosophy, or policy but in terms of group identity. In that sense, politics is the USA is effectively binary rather than one dimensional. If you’re going to talk about something like philosophical values, you could have almost infinite dimensions, but you’d find it impossible to place most actual voters anywhere because the dimensions will represent things they have no opinion on and have never thought about.
  - mindslight 11mo ago
    I've always taken the horseshoe end to be individual liberty, with "centrists" being more the corporate-authoritarian agenda. So that you're construing in the opposite way shows that while the concept might be somewhat enlightening, it's not really a super useful model.

by _yb2s 11mo ago

mindslight 11mo ago

It's the fake rightist "Libertarianism" of freedom for me, but not for thee. The main freedom he desires is the freedom to coerce other people. This is patently not libertarianism, but that doesn't stop these powermongers from cloaking themselves in the label to distract from their goals while assuaging their own egos. Similar to how they use religion.

nis0s 11mo ago
In a word, horseshoe theory. If you’re on the extreme sides of the political spectrum, you’re essentially authoritarian, even if you don’t necessarily “feel” that you are authoritarian.
- tmtvl 11mo ago
  The political spectrum isn't left to right, despite some places seeming that way. The political spectrum is both progressive to conservative and libertarian to authoritarian. Although that's a lie and it isn't as simple as that either, because it doesn't work for differentiating green conservatives from regular conservatives, for example.
  - mindslight 11mo ago
    Green conservatives are still talking about climate change as their main issue. Regular conservatives just want these fucking fascists deposed, in prison, and their deplorable enablers back to being ashamed ^_^
  - _yb2s 11mo ago
    I’d argue the opposite- most people don’t think of politics in terms of goals, philosophy, or policy but in terms of group identity. In that sense, politics is the USA is effectively binary rather than one dimensional. If you’re going to talk about something like philosophical values, you could have almost infinite dimensions, but you’d find it impossible to place most actual voters anywhere because the dimensions will represent things they have no opinion on and have never thought about.
- mindslight 11mo ago
  I've always taken the horseshoe end to be individual liberty, with "centrists" being more the corporate-authoritarian agenda. So that you're construing in the opposite way shows that while the concept might be somewhat enlightening, it's not really a super useful model.