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I still don’t see why you would want your parents to run untrusted software on their devices, but you do you I guess.
by moi2388 1y ago
I still don’t see why you would want your parents to run untrusted software on their devices, but you do you I guess.
- Propelloni 1y agoI still don't see why you would want Apple to have a say in what you run on your device, but you do you, I guess.
- MagicMoonlight 1y agoBecause they have thousands of employees who have the time to look at the source code and determine whether it is malicious. Nobody else would bother. That’s why meme language repositories continuously lead to hacks and vulnerabilities.
- rkomorn 1y agoApple employees have access to the source code of apps on the App Store?
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- BoredPositron 1y agoTechnically yes, if they want it you have to give it to them. The dev agreement and TOS is pretty broad.
- rkomorn 1y agoIs that (Apple asking for source) a frequent thing?
- BoredPositron 1y agoWe don't know.
- aeonfox 1y agoApp developers do know. I can't say that I've ever worked on an app where this request has been made. Neither the App Store Connect Agreement[0] nor the Apple Developer Agreement[1] stipulates that the developer can be compelled to surrender their source code. [0] https://appstoreconnect.apple.com/WebObjects/iTunesConnect.woa/wa/termsOfService/ https://appstoreconnect.apple.com/WebObjects/iTunesConnect.w... [1] https://developer.apple.com/support/downloads/terms/apple-developer-agreement/Apple-Developer-Agreement-20250318-English.pdf https://developer.apple.com/support/downloads/terms/apple-de... All the relevant agreements can be found here, so if there's something that specifies this kind of overreach, I'd both be very surprised and interested. https://developer.apple.com/support/terms/ https://developer.apple.com/support/terms/
- BoredPositron 1y ago“If you are required by law, regulation, or court order to disclose any Apple Confidential Information (which can include requests related to legal investigations or audits), you agree to give Apple prompt notice and to cooperate in seeking a protective order or confidential treatment of such information”
- rkomorn 1y agoWhat part of this says Apple can compel developers to share their apps' source with Apple? Edit: oh, are you saying that such requests would be "Apple confidential information" so nobody would say if it happened?
- aeonfox 1y agoThey haven't read the document properly. Here's the definition: > any information disclosed by Apple to you in connection with Apple Events will be considered and referred to as “Apple Confidential Information” and are subject to the confidentiality obligations of this Agreement The definition of Apple Events: > As an Apple Developer, you may have the opportunity to attend certain Apple developer conferences, technical talks, and other events (including online or electronic broadcasts of such events) (“Apple Events”).
- lapcat 1y agoThis has literally never happened.
- lapcat 1y agoNo.
- robertclaus 1y agoApple absolutely does not manually read all the source code they notarized.
- lapcat 1y agoThey don't notarize source code at all. They notarize compiled app binaries. Many or even most App Store apps are closed source.
- realusername 1y agoYou are mixing up with Fdroid, Apple doesn't do any source code reading and the tests they do are very basic. Right now you have a lot of piracy apps which are disguised as a "note taking app" and they passed the appstore review without any issues.
- heinternets 1y agoDo you have any examples? Asking for a friend.
- moi2388 1y agoThey don’t. You can still run any software you’d like. You just get warnings, so people like parents don’t just randomly open malicious programs from the internet. Which is exactly as it should be
- whatsupdog 1y agoTell me how I can side load apps on iphone? Even with warnings and stuff.
- owisd 1y agoIf you compile it from source yourself using Xcode you can deploy to your own device without an Apple developer subscription.
- lanyard-textile 1y agoIt unfortunately goes away. Last I checked you get 7 days before the app expires. The subscription makes it last much longer, but not forever.
- whatsupdog 1y agoI want to install YouPorn app. They are not going to hand me their source code.
- djantje 1y agoIt should be a setting (like macos) otherwise full control of all the devices is always at the mercy of Apple.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- realusername 1y agoImplying the software in the appstore is ""trusted""
- wiseowise 1y agoWho said anything about parents?
- noir_lord 1y agoThey are using it as a proxy for "people with low technical skills" (which is a specious argument since it was a friend of my parents who got me into programming and he remains one of the best I've ever known) and making the usual argument that we should limit control of our devices to make it safe for them. I actually don't have (much) of an issue with walled garden approaches as long as the wall has a gate that is easily opened, give me an OS level toggle with a warning of "Here be dragons" and I can live with it - it's not ideal but it's not a terrible trade off. It's something Android has had previously (but they seem to be trying to lock that gate) and iOS less so.
- graemep 1y agoWhich is something I find very annoying, because I know a lot of people who are parents (or adults) or grandparents which have greater technical skills than their children.
- brabel 1y agoI can run anything on my Mac the way you described: go to security settings and tell it know what I am doing. Is that changing somehow?
- CuriousSkeptic 1y agoHow about instead of a single os level toggle you get a trillion dollar company, renowned for their high quality design, invested in providing the best possible UX while respecting the user as the owner of the device?
- gumby271 1y agoTell me more about this mythical mobile device and I'll buy one immediately!
- rogual 1y agoIt's funny how "think of the parents" is the new "think of the children".
- owisd 1y agoIt’s tragic how many are baffled by the idea someone might genuinely accept a minor inconvenience to benefit their community.
- gumby271 1y agoRight, if we could educate users on the tools they use, and if the trillion dollar companies could provide tools to help community members protect each other, we wouldn't be here. Apple doesn't have to be a dictator if they would help the community support each other. Instead they took the easy way out of stripping freedoms from everyone so they can control every device out there. It's a minor inconvenience to be involved in protecting vulnerable people in our community, it's tragic that people just said Apple should take that role.
- orangecat 1y agoI strongly dispute that giving megacorporations total control of how we're allowed to use our computing devices is beneficial to any community.
- saubeidl 1y agoBecause they're adults that can make their own decisions and not mentally challenged patients under a megacorps guardianship?
- gregoriol 1y agoSadly about 98% of real world users are going to fall into scams, ransomwares and stuff. They are not mentally challenged, there are just so many traps/fakes/tempting stuff that we as IT people are more aware of (but even we still fall into some). We also can't count on every person being able to check every single thing they do: how do you check if some food or drug you get is good or not? you can't really, you have to trust someone who knows.
- saubeidl 1y ago> how do you check if some food or drug you get is good or not? you can't really, you have to trust someone who knows. Yes - the democratically elected government, not a monopolistic entity with capital interest.
- userbinator 1y agoThen that's their own fault and responsibility. You can't build up immunity without exposure.
- owisd 1y agoIt’s a bit like the Elizabeth Warren toaster analogy. If you bought a toaster with shoddy wiring and it caught fire and burned down your house, everyone would blame the manufacturer and not sneer at you online for not learning electrical engineering and not checking the wiring yourself before using it.
- beeflet 1y agoI don't buy this in the first place. It is reasonable to expect consumers to do some background research into the products they buy. In fact, it is the only way capitalism can function as a meritocracy. Society should be more dangerous as a means to force people to learn more about technology they rely on.
- tacker2000 1y agoThis argument is in the same vein as “chat control because of child safety”. Its a smokescreen. You want less liberty because of the “least competent” user?
- tgv 1y agoSoftware freedom, at least for end users, is a smokescreen, too. I can revert your argument: "you want more ransomware because of a few OSS enthousiasts?" What we need is a way to curb the excesses, such as high entrance barriers to the store. A phone/tablet is a tool, with very intense usage, and huge privacy value, not an engineer's toy.
- idle_zealot 1y agoThe real smokescreen is this freedom vs security false dichotomy. If you give up freedom for the promise of security, you get neither. Look at the App Store. It's full of harmful garbage designed to extract value and waste your time by any trick necessary. It's one step short of ransomware. Oh, unless you use an app for your important documents, then it comes under new management and demands you start paying monthly or lose your stuff. Suddenly that lack of freedom to continue using an old version of the app or to dig around its internals and pull out your data becomes a loss of security. It's fine though, because this type of ransomware is totally legal and inline with your benevolent platform dictator's policies.
- Ray20 1y agoYour argument falls apart when you consider iPhones' 60% market share. People have spoken out about whether they want dangerous, uncontrolled third-party apps on their phones.
- beeflet 1y agoI don't care about what the riff-raff think, it is morally wrong and defies human freedom and dignity to require everyone walk around with a locked-down surveilance device in their pocket in order to function in the economy. 60% of society could be raptured tomorrow and the world would be better off.
- rpdillon 1y agoThe point is that they trust it, whether or not Apple trusts it is completely orthogonal, and irrelevant. Apple doesn't own the phone.
- sys_64738 1y agoWhat do your kids say to this?
- lapcat 1y ago> I still don’t see why you would want your parents to run untrusted software on their devices, but you do you I guess. I don't trust Apple's App Store review. They've approved countless scams that have tricked Apple users out of a lot of money, perhaps $billions in total.