3 ms·

It's not the libertarian vote that he cared about in particular so much as it was the firehose of crypto money that was supporting free ross.

IncreasePosts 11mo ago
This seems more likely - how many libertarians are there in the US? Surely there are much larger groups you can appeal to if votes is what you're after
- godshatter 11mo ago
  There are dozens of us. And none of us can agree on anything.
  - nazgulsenpai 11mo ago
    Libertarians are like independents except noone wants to try to win us over
    - Ray20 11mo ago
      > Libertarians are like independents except noone wants to try to win us over Because they are not like independents. Democrats have moved so far left that it's not even a question of who libertarians will vote for. The candidate just needs to show them a little attention so they remember to register and vote.
- mothballed 11mo ago
  I don't think the crypto crowd was ever at hazard at not voting for Trump, so I'm not sure what the advantage would have been with respect to them. However, the libertarian crowd was. As a libertarian voter, the pardon for Ross was the only thing Trump did that actually brought me pause. To the point, I felt immensely guilty for not voting for him when I voted (L) because I knew[thought] I was damning Ross to a jail cell. It weighed on my conscious for a long time after the vote, an it wasn't until Trump won I felt somewhat absolved of the guilt.
  - kmeisthax 11mo ago
    My personal opinion regarding the Ross pardon is that the Libertarian Party sold its soul for a donut. They could have gotten way more out of Trump than pardoning one particular Internet drug dealer.
    - smw 11mo ago
      Internet drug dealer doesn't really concern me, but he tried to have someone killed!
- anigbrowl 11mo ago
  The Libertarian party got ~4.5 million votes in 2016. Getting some of those votes, or dissuading them from voting, is enough to make a difference in a tight race. See my other answer upthread for more context.
anigbrowl 11mo ago
Both are true. For a long time the Libertarian party was seen as drawing away small numbers of protest votes from the GOP, being populated by (mostly) guys who rejected Democratic over-regulation and nanny-statism but also rejected the GOP's anti-abortion politics, criminalization of drugs etc. A few years ago there was an organized effort to capture key roles in the Libertarian party and focus the organization more on property rights and capitalism, with less emphasis on personal freedoms and constitutional limitations on government. This effectively split the Libertarian party, neutering it as electoral factor. Now, the Libertarian party never mustered a large share of the vote, but many electoral contests are won at the margins. They managed to get ~3% of the vote in 2016, but lost >80% of that over the following 2 elections. https://www.the-pechko-perspective.com/political-commentary/2578722_the-mises-caucus-takeover-how-libertarianism-lost-its-way https://www.the-pechko-perspective.com/political-commentary/... https://www.splcenter.org/resources/hatewatch/libertarian-party-loses-state-parties-donors-after-hard-right-turn/ https://www.splcenter.org/resources/hatewatch/libertarian-pa... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Libertarian_Party_presidential_tickets https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Libertar...

IncreasePosts 11mo ago

This seems more likely - how many libertarians are there in the US? Surely there are much larger groups you can appeal to if votes is what you're after

godshatter 11mo ago
There are dozens of us. And none of us can agree on anything.
- nazgulsenpai 11mo ago
  Libertarians are like independents except noone wants to try to win us over
  - Ray20 11mo ago
    > Libertarians are like independents except noone wants to try to win us over Because they are not like independents. Democrats have moved so far left that it's not even a question of who libertarians will vote for. The candidate just needs to show them a little attention so they remember to register and vote.
mothballed 11mo ago
I don't think the crypto crowd was ever at hazard at not voting for Trump, so I'm not sure what the advantage would have been with respect to them. However, the libertarian crowd was. As a libertarian voter, the pardon for Ross was the only thing Trump did that actually brought me pause. To the point, I felt immensely guilty for not voting for him when I voted (L) because I knew[thought] I was damning Ross to a jail cell. It weighed on my conscious for a long time after the vote, an it wasn't until Trump won I felt somewhat absolved of the guilt.
- kmeisthax 11mo ago
  My personal opinion regarding the Ross pardon is that the Libertarian Party sold its soul for a donut. They could have gotten way more out of Trump than pardoning one particular Internet drug dealer.
  - smw 11mo ago
    Internet drug dealer doesn't really concern me, but he tried to have someone killed!
anigbrowl 11mo ago
The Libertarian party got ~4.5 million votes in 2016. Getting some of those votes, or dissuading them from voting, is enough to make a difference in a tight race. See my other answer upthread for more context.

anigbrowl 11mo ago

Both are true. For a long time the Libertarian party was seen as drawing away small numbers of protest votes from the GOP, being populated by (mostly) guys who rejected Democratic over-regulation and nanny-statism but also rejected the GOP's anti-abortion politics, criminalization of drugs etc. A few years ago there was an organized effort to capture key roles in the Libertarian party and focus the organization more on property rights and capitalism, with less emphasis on personal freedoms and constitutional limitations on government. This effectively split the Libertarian party, neutering it as electoral factor. Now, the Libertarian party never mustered a large share of the vote, but many electoral contests are won at the margins. They managed to get ~3% of the vote in 2016, but lost >80% of that over the following 2 elections. https://www.the-pechko-perspective.com/political-commentary/2578722_the-mises-caucus-takeover-how-libertarianism-lost-its-way https://www.the-pechko-perspective.com/political-commentary/... https://www.splcenter.org/resources/hatewatch/libertarian-party-loses-state-parties-donors-after-hard-right-turn/ https://www.splcenter.org/resources/hatewatch/libertarian-pa... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Libertarian_Party_presidential_tickets https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Libertar...