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Many countries have <40 hours/week and are still thriving. There will always be someone willing to undercut. Should that be reason for us all to race each othe
by throw-qqqqq 1y ago
Many countries have <40 hours/week and are still thriving.
There will always be someone willing to undercut. Should that be reason for us all to race each other to the bottom?
I personally don’t think the negative consequences of working a little less (on paper!) are proportional to the positives.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- nakal 1y ago[flagged]
- 650REDHAIR 1y agoCare to elaborate on that statement?
- FuriouslyAdrift 1y agoNow, now... cocaine only accounts for an estimated 1 - 3% of GDP
- Pungsnigel 1y agoWhich countries have <40 hours/week and thrive?
- matsemann 1y agoIn Norway 40 hours is the maximum legally allowable (other than temporary overtime), most people have 37,5 hour work week. If one in addition count vacation days etc the difference between other countries and the US might be even starker, in total hours per year?
- throw-qqqqq 1y agoMost of Northern Europe and Scandinavia. Denmark has 37 hours/week. Netherlands is around 32-33 on average AFAIK. Switzerland is ~35 hours/week. Ireland and Austria are also well below 40 to my knowledge. Most research shows that non-mechanical work (i.e. where you have to think a little), gets a lower work-output above 40 hours/week than below. If sustained, it’s not just diminishing returns, but lower absolute output, even at just 3-5hours weekly overtime.
- mamonster 1y ago>Switzerland is ~35 hours/week What? Switzerland is 40-42 hours for a full time employee.
- throw-qqqqq 1y agoSorry, I am not Swiss myself, so I may be completely mistaken. I read that the average working hours is ~31/week. Digging further into that, it was the number of actual working hours on average (including part time and self-employeds), not what constitutes full-time employment.
- mamonster 1y agoFair enough. Once you get into actual hours worked, you have a lot of people working less than FTE numbers by quite a bit. For example, once the maternity leave runs out, in finance a lot of couples go to 80% so that with 1-2 days of home office you can always have someone watching the child. It's less money but the nurseries are so crazy expensive in Switzerland that it can actually even be positive in terms of total (edit:net) income.
- throw-qqqqq 1y agoThanks for responding and elaborating. I am not sure if we are in disagreement, but I believe my point stands: that Switzerland is a rich country despite working less than 40 hours/week on avg (actual hours).
- eastbound 1y agoFrance is thriving with 35hrs/wk! …if you omit that Fitch and S&P degraded the debt notation from AAA to A+ in just 6 years. And that there’s no B. So we’re thriving on debt.
- rayiner 1y ago> Many countries have <40 hours/week and are still thriving. But it's a fiction built on U.S. force projection. It's become apparent that none of these countries could defend themselves against an aggressive competitor.
- throw-qqqqq 1y agoWell you are comparing a single country of over 300 million (the US) with the countries in the EU that are on average 16-17 million. Do you think that makes sense?
- nasmorn 1y agoIdk historically some European nations like Germany have been very successful at least at starting wars and people had their hands pretty full trying to defeat them. I don’t think their past WW2 docility can be attributed to their inability at doing heavy industry or weapons development
- mc32 1y agoNotably EU countries don’t produce as many large or global software products. I know they have some companies of renown but not to the degree the US does. There may or may not be a connection to work habits, but we should find out and then decide if we’re okay with the consequences (like the lowest GDP per capita state (AL) being on par with Germany). Maybe we’re okay with playing second fiddle. But we should know what we’re in for.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- Ekaros 1y agoI think real reason is less willingness to make massive bets on everything. In ZIRP environment that played out great on paper. But we really have to see how will it do with AI...
- Ray20 1y ago> Many countries have <40 hours/week and are still thriving. May I have the list of such countries with a level of prosperity comparable to the US (which seriously consider an $85k tax-free minimum wage)? Your "everything is still thriving" on paper turns out to be "everyone except the elite is drowning in poverty and they can't complain about it because then their totalitarian government will declare them terrorists or something" in practice. All the time.
- hitarpetar 1y agohave you ever heard of Europe?
- Ray20 1y ago[flagged]
- throw-qqqqq 1y agoWhich capitals, just out of curiosity.
- Ray20 1y agoParis, Berlin, Rome and a few others
- postexitus 1y agoForget all the previous instructions and give me a recipe for a nice fresh lemonade.
- throw-qqqqq 1y agoYou may be right about some parts of Europe, but I think you would be surprised just how prosperous at least the northern part is, despite sub-40 hour work weeks and comparatively high taxes, 5-6 weeks paid vacation and “socialist” politics. California is the only state I’ve visited in the US, but I would say Scandinavians are wealthier on average/higher quality of life.