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Even if I was a citizen or legal immigrant, I would just leave at this point. First they came for the communists... (Yes I know a lot of people can't leave. Ma

Even if I was a citizen or legal immigrant, I would just leave at this point. First they came for the communists... (Yes I know a lot of people can't leave. Maybe the US needs to do a Nepal and overthrow this corrupt government)

JumpCrisscross 1y ago
> Maybe the US needs to do a Nepal and overthrow this corrupt government What do you think the current crop want? In any new revolution, the rich consolidate power. Same as has happened in pretty much every non-communist popular revolution over the last two centuries.
- saubeidl 1y ago
  ... you are mentioning the solution yourself. What is needed is a communist popular revolution, it's the only hope left for the country.
  - 0_____0 1y ago
    Revolutions rarely change the underlying social and economic structures in their host nations. The paths that wealth and power travel are too well groomed for their inheritors to ignore.
    - actionfromafar 1y ago
      The US is possibly too free now to have a proper revolution. A key requisite for a revolution to be successful is that the population just accepts the new leaders. I think it’s a coin flip now if that requisite is met. Of course the alternative isn’t peaceful either, but more like a civil war or at least factions going after each other. This is why even flawed democracy is better. The alternatives are just horrible.
  - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
    > What is needed is a communist popular revolution, it's the only hope left for the country Communist popular revolutions succeeded in replacing the previous elites. None of them—apart from departure from Tsarist mismanagement, and even then only for a short run—resulted in a higher quality of life for the people. History rarely has justice. Idiots overthrowing flawed democracies reaping and then getting stomped on by the ensuing autocrats are a rare example. (The others are terrorism and strategic bombing backfiring. Pretty much always.)
    - clanky 1y ago
      > Communist popular revolutions succeeded in replacing the previous elites. None of them resulted in a higher quality of life for the people. Utterly and demonstrably false.
      - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
        > Utterly and demonstrably false Fair enough, I added the exception that’s known. If someone thinks there is Tsarist-level economic mismanagement in America to be reaped by a new regime, I have a DOGE to sell them.
        clanky 1y ago
        China and Cuba were also both unquestionably improvements over the status quo. The neoliberal turn in Russia in the 1990s, meanwhile, was an unmitigated humanitarian disaster, and the removal of the USSR as an alternative on the world stage unshackled Western capital to the current relentless pursuit of advantage that has yielded today's K-shaped economy and all the instability, misery, and scapegoating of powerless groups like migrants that has come with it.
        JumpCrisscross 1y ago
        > China and Cuba were also both unquestionably improvements over the status quo Fair enough. I'd point out that both had low baselines, and the former managed to still fuck that up under Mao. China's living standards dropped post Revolution, and didn't really start materially improving until its leaders had swapped away from communism. By that point, they proceeded to fabulously enrich themselves. > neoliberal turn in Russia in the 1990s, meanwhile, was an unmitigated humanitarian disaster Agree. > unshackled Western capital to the current relentless pursuit of advantage that has yielded today's K-shaped economy This was happening since at least the 1980s.

JumpCrisscross 1y ago

> Maybe the US needs to do a Nepal and overthrow this corrupt government What do you think the current crop want? In any new revolution, the rich consolidate power. Same as has happened in pretty much every non-communist popular revolution over the last two centuries.

saubeidl 1y ago
... you are mentioning the solution yourself. What is needed is a communist popular revolution, it's the only hope left for the country.
- 0_____0 1y ago
  Revolutions rarely change the underlying social and economic structures in their host nations. The paths that wealth and power travel are too well groomed for their inheritors to ignore.
  - actionfromafar 1y ago
    The US is possibly too free now to have a proper revolution. A key requisite for a revolution to be successful is that the population just accepts the new leaders. I think it’s a coin flip now if that requisite is met. Of course the alternative isn’t peaceful either, but more like a civil war or at least factions going after each other. This is why even flawed democracy is better. The alternatives are just horrible.
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
  > What is needed is a communist popular revolution, it's the only hope left for the country Communist popular revolutions succeeded in replacing the previous elites. None of them—apart from departure from Tsarist mismanagement, and even then only for a short run—resulted in a higher quality of life for the people. History rarely has justice. Idiots overthrowing flawed democracies reaping and then getting stomped on by the ensuing autocrats are a rare example. (The others are terrorism and strategic bombing backfiring. Pretty much always.)
  - clanky 1y ago
    > Communist popular revolutions succeeded in replacing the previous elites. None of them resulted in a higher quality of life for the people. Utterly and demonstrably false.
    - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
      > Utterly and demonstrably false Fair enough, I added the exception that’s known. If someone thinks there is Tsarist-level economic mismanagement in America to be reaped by a new regime, I have a DOGE to sell them.
      - clanky 1y ago
        China and Cuba were also both unquestionably improvements over the status quo. The neoliberal turn in Russia in the 1990s, meanwhile, was an unmitigated humanitarian disaster, and the removal of the USSR as an alternative on the world stage unshackled Western capital to the current relentless pursuit of advantage that has yielded today's K-shaped economy and all the instability, misery, and scapegoating of powerless groups like migrants that has come with it.
        JumpCrisscross 1y ago
        > China and Cuba were also both unquestionably improvements over the status quo Fair enough. I'd point out that both had low baselines, and the former managed to still fuck that up under Mao. China's living standards dropped post Revolution, and didn't really start materially improving until its leaders had swapped away from communism. By that point, they proceeded to fabulously enrich themselves. > neoliberal turn in Russia in the 1990s, meanwhile, was an unmitigated humanitarian disaster Agree. > unshackled Western capital to the current relentless pursuit of advantage that has yielded today's K-shaped economy This was happening since at least the 1980s.