3 ms·

The earth doesn't give a shit about per capita, and us and eu are net reducing CO2 emissions since 2014 (even during trump I)

mtmickush 11mo ago
The earth isn't a person. I think it seems valid to consider the harm and or benefits being caused on a per person basis. Why should an individual in the US be allowed to release more CO2 emissions than an individual in China?
- GenerocUsername 11mo ago
  Yes thats right.
- ben_w 11mo ago
  > Why should an individual in the US be allowed to release more CO2 emissions than an individual in China? The lack of a single world government is why. Agreements between nations are only enforced by honour, and while that's more than nothing, it's not great. The practical outcome of this is that who is "allowed" to do anything is dynamic, and who may do something the most can be inverted extremely quickly.
malshe 11mo ago
I am with you on this one. I have seen people making similar arguments about plastic dumped in the oceans where at least until about a decade ago China was well ahead of every nation. The oceans don't care about the per capita plastic polluting them.
- throwawaymaths 11mo ago
  Yeah currently the biggest source of oceanic plastic is phillipines IIRC
amalcon 11mo ago
The earth also doesn't care about national borders, so why are national numbers more useful in this regard?
- ben_w 11mo ago
  Governments have a lot of control over things within their borders, and are held responsible when bad things happen within them.
8ytecoder 11mo ago
US: 335M / 5,000M ton / 15 ton Indonesia: 275M / 650M ton / 2.3 ton Pakistan: 240M / 225M ton / 1 ton Nigeria: 220M / 110M ton / 0.5 ton Brazil: 215M / 475M ton / 2.2 ton I can go on and on about the countries that are emitting less than the US. People and animals live in areas that are liveable. So countries near the equator and fertile countries will always be more populous. So how else do you propose we compare countries? Which are themselves mostly arbitrary lines as far as the earth is concerned - so why chunk by countries? It has to be per person right?
- throwawaymaths 11mo ago
  > So how else do you propose we compare countries dCO2/dt

mtmickush 11mo ago

The earth isn't a person. I think it seems valid to consider the harm and or benefits being caused on a per person basis. Why should an individual in the US be allowed to release more CO2 emissions than an individual in China?

GenerocUsername 11mo ago
Yes thats right.
ben_w 11mo ago
> Why should an individual in the US be allowed to release more CO2 emissions than an individual in China? The lack of a single world government is why. Agreements between nations are only enforced by honour, and while that's more than nothing, it's not great. The practical outcome of this is that who is "allowed" to do anything is dynamic, and who may do something the most can be inverted extremely quickly.

malshe 11mo ago

I am with you on this one. I have seen people making similar arguments about plastic dumped in the oceans where at least until about a decade ago China was well ahead of every nation. The oceans don't care about the per capita plastic polluting them.

throwawaymaths 11mo ago
Yeah currently the biggest source of oceanic plastic is phillipines IIRC

amalcon 11mo ago

The earth also doesn't care about national borders, so why are national numbers more useful in this regard?

ben_w 11mo ago
Governments have a lot of control over things within their borders, and are held responsible when bad things happen within them.

8ytecoder 11mo ago

US: 335M / 5,000M ton / 15 ton Indonesia: 275M / 650M ton / 2.3 ton Pakistan: 240M / 225M ton / 1 ton Nigeria: 220M / 110M ton / 0.5 ton Brazil: 215M / 475M ton / 2.2 ton I can go on and on about the countries that are emitting less than the US. People and animals live in areas that are liveable. So countries near the equator and fertile countries will always be more populous. So how else do you propose we compare countries? Which are themselves mostly arbitrary lines as far as the earth is concerned - so why chunk by countries? It has to be per person right?

throwawaymaths 11mo ago
> So how else do you propose we compare countries dCO2/dt