9 ms·

Ask the AI for all the falsehoods and contradictions. Ask it how you can tell a false prophet from a real one. This Christianity stuff has poetry in it but the

Ask the AI for all the falsehoods and contradictions. Ask it how you can tell a false prophet from a real one. This Christianity stuff has poetry in it but the religion and the texts are far apart. Exactly which laws of the Old Testament were voided? Or must Christians abide by them all? Was the Tower of Babel's destruction just a fleeting tantrum? Who did Cain marry if there were no other women? How did Noah get all the scorpions and biting insects? Thanks for the bedbugs and typhoid, dude. Generally an incoherent scheme.

8note 11mo ago
why didnt noah talk about how much more dangerous the bugs and animals in austrialia are? or say he put all the dangerous animals there? a bit of warning woulda been nice
rightbyte 11mo ago
> Who did Cain marry if there were no other women? Like, stuff like that doesn't matter. It is not the point of the story. I don't think the oral tradition cared about plot holes at all.
- Coffeewine 11mo ago
  Of course it doesn’t. But there is a difference between treating the story as an oral tradition and the explicit and unerring word of god.
- CamperBob2 11mo ago
  It should certainly matter to fundamentalists, who have an outsized influence in politics. They regularly pick the most questionable translations of the most vague and obscure verses and ram them down everyone else's throats. It doesn't matter to them, but it should.
- quantified 11mo ago
  If the religion is just some fallible oral tradition, it is no better than an institutionalized TV show. Its claims for humanity are far too important for that. Remember, the Gospels weren't written contemporaneously. Only after something like 4-5 generations. And when have we heard of people changing or faking history to suit their own ends? The Judeo-Christian god is a nacissistic, somewhat sadistic mob boss. Way too human.
  - ntkhan 11mo ago
    4-5 generations is a stretch, though it depends on what you mean by generation. Most New Testament Scholars including atheists agree that the New Testament was written while the some of the 12 apostles were still alive. For example, agnostic atheist Dr. Bart Ehrman (Masters of Divinity and Ph.D. from Princeton Theological Seminary) states "Critical scholars are widely agreed that the earliest Gospel was Mark, written around 70 c.e.; that Matthew and Luke were written some years later, say, around 80–85 c.e.; and that John was the last Gospel, written around 90–95 c.e." The historical record also has the disciples (St. Clement, St. Polycarp, St. Ignatius) of the apostles quoting the Gospels or referring to the letters of the apostles shortly after those dates ~90-108 AD depending on who you ask. Regarding "faking history to suit their own ends", it is hard to imagine what gain the early Christians got by faking history. Some of these people were tortured, crucified, and fed to wild beasts by members of the Roman government because they were making these claims. Not exactly a racket.
    - quantified 11mo ago
      Thank you for the detail. I had a more loose understanding of "about 100 years" after. If a generation is 20 years (at that point in history), that would be 5 generations. 25 years per, 4 generations. The fact that many details of his actions are shared with other legends/traditions sure makes it look like he existed as a person and had lots of stories attributed to him. The Councils of Nicea and Trent could not have been free of politics. Those who were told falsehoods and believed them might well hold firm. Let's be real, evidence for the theology around the stories is lacking. This god does not show any influence of existence for a very long time. It's just people doing what people do.
      - ntkhan 11mo ago
        You're welcome. The details shared with many other legends/traditions claim is also usually incorrect, particularly "god x was also crucified, rose from the dead, born of a virgin, had twelve dsiciples" etc. Usually these types of claims can be tied back to very specific films/books etc. For example the film 'Zeitgeist' makes wild assertions about Jesus & Horus sharing key details which have been debunked many times over. This is so common that there is a popular YouTube video that satirizes the concept called 'Horus Ruins Christmas' by LutheranSatire. I agree, no Church council was free of politics. Not an issue for me though: the Church's stated mission is to teach the nations to obey all that God commanded. (Mat 28:19) That sort of mission is going to get political one way or another. I don't find the evidence for the theology to be lacking at all: the eucharistic miracles in Tixla, Mexico and Legnica, Poland happened this century. There was also the miracle of the sun at Fatima. Daniel 2 was written hundred of years before Christianity and predicts that the Roman Empire would be absorbed by the kingdom of God. That same kingdom which would start small and slowly cover the earth: this fits basically exactly with the transformation of the Roman Empire into a Christian state and now Christianity covers the globe. That's just one of many fulfilled prophecies. I don't see how a naturalistic explanation is adequate for repeated knowledge of the future over the course of hundreds of years or the repeated eyewitness testimony of people seeing these miracles.

8note 11mo ago

why didnt noah talk about how much more dangerous the bugs and animals in austrialia are? or say he put all the dangerous animals there? a bit of warning woulda been nice

rightbyte 11mo ago

> Who did Cain marry if there were no other women? Like, stuff like that doesn't matter. It is not the point of the story. I don't think the oral tradition cared about plot holes at all.

Coffeewine 11mo ago
Of course it doesn’t. But there is a difference between treating the story as an oral tradition and the explicit and unerring word of god.
CamperBob2 11mo ago
It should certainly matter to fundamentalists, who have an outsized influence in politics. They regularly pick the most questionable translations of the most vague and obscure verses and ram them down everyone else's throats. It doesn't matter to them, but it should.
quantified 11mo ago
If the religion is just some fallible oral tradition, it is no better than an institutionalized TV show. Its claims for humanity are far too important for that. Remember, the Gospels weren't written contemporaneously. Only after something like 4-5 generations. And when have we heard of people changing or faking history to suit their own ends? The Judeo-Christian god is a nacissistic, somewhat sadistic mob boss. Way too human.
- ntkhan 11mo ago
  4-5 generations is a stretch, though it depends on what you mean by generation. Most New Testament Scholars including atheists agree that the New Testament was written while the some of the 12 apostles were still alive. For example, agnostic atheist Dr. Bart Ehrman (Masters of Divinity and Ph.D. from Princeton Theological Seminary) states "Critical scholars are widely agreed that the earliest Gospel was Mark, written around 70 c.e.; that Matthew and Luke were written some years later, say, around 80–85 c.e.; and that John was the last Gospel, written around 90–95 c.e." The historical record also has the disciples (St. Clement, St. Polycarp, St. Ignatius) of the apostles quoting the Gospels or referring to the letters of the apostles shortly after those dates ~90-108 AD depending on who you ask. Regarding "faking history to suit their own ends", it is hard to imagine what gain the early Christians got by faking history. Some of these people were tortured, crucified, and fed to wild beasts by members of the Roman government because they were making these claims. Not exactly a racket.
  - quantified 11mo ago
    Thank you for the detail. I had a more loose understanding of "about 100 years" after. If a generation is 20 years (at that point in history), that would be 5 generations. 25 years per, 4 generations. The fact that many details of his actions are shared with other legends/traditions sure makes it look like he existed as a person and had lots of stories attributed to him. The Councils of Nicea and Trent could not have been free of politics. Those who were told falsehoods and believed them might well hold firm. Let's be real, evidence for the theology around the stories is lacking. This god does not show any influence of existence for a very long time. It's just people doing what people do.
    - ntkhan 11mo ago
      You're welcome. The details shared with many other legends/traditions claim is also usually incorrect, particularly "god x was also crucified, rose from the dead, born of a virgin, had twelve dsiciples" etc. Usually these types of claims can be tied back to very specific films/books etc. For example the film 'Zeitgeist' makes wild assertions about Jesus & Horus sharing key details which have been debunked many times over. This is so common that there is a popular YouTube video that satirizes the concept called 'Horus Ruins Christmas' by LutheranSatire. I agree, no Church council was free of politics. Not an issue for me though: the Church's stated mission is to teach the nations to obey all that God commanded. (Mat 28:19) That sort of mission is going to get political one way or another. I don't find the evidence for the theology to be lacking at all: the eucharistic miracles in Tixla, Mexico and Legnica, Poland happened this century. There was also the miracle of the sun at Fatima. Daniel 2 was written hundred of years before Christianity and predicts that the Roman Empire would be absorbed by the kingdom of God. That same kingdom which would start small and slowly cover the earth: this fits basically exactly with the transformation of the Roman Empire into a Christian state and now Christianity covers the globe. That's just one of many fulfilled prophecies. I don't see how a naturalistic explanation is adequate for repeated knowledge of the future over the course of hundreds of years or the repeated eyewitness testimony of people seeing these miracles.