3 ms·

Yep, VCs don't exist here. Plus the absurd starting costs, it's like what, 20k to set up a GmbH?

troupo 1y ago
2.5k EUR in starting capital, and two founders to start a a limited liability company (AB) in Sweden, and a 240 EUR processing fee: https://verksamt.se/starta-foretag/valj-foretagsform/aktiebolag https://verksamt.se/starta-foretag/valj-foretagsform/aktiebo... And you register online.
- pier25 1y ago
  Depends on the country. Opening a company in Estonia is very cheap but in Spain the manager/CEO needs to be an "autónomo" (like a self-employed tax status). This costs thousands of Euros per year. Something like 2,400-30,000 Euros per year, every year, forever.
  - troupo 1y ago
    And that's probably one of the big obstacles in the EU: there's no common ground for these things. At least this will hopefully be addressed: https://www.reuters.com/business/eu-propose-uniform-rules-startups-help-them-grow-von-der-leyen-says-2025-10-03/ https://www.reuters.com/business/eu-propose-uniform-rules-st...
    - vanviegen 1y ago
      What does it matter that the rules for establishing differ per country? I'm only founding in one of them. The article is unclear, but is probably referring to making it easier for startups to offer products in other EU countries.
      - troupo 1y ago
        The idea is to establish common rules to make it easier to register and move startups between countries, among other things. It's in very early stages, so info is very scattered. More info, for example, here: https://www.loyensloeff.com/insights/news--events/news/the-28th-legal-regime-enhancing-european-competitiveness-and-innovation/ https://www.loyensloeff.com/insights/news--events/news/the-2...
    - deaux 1y ago
      So what? There's no common ground in the US either, and it's not an issue there.
      - troupo 1y ago
        The ground is significantly more common than in the EU. And that's just one of the problems (many of the problems have nothing to do with European bureaucracy)
        deaux 1y ago
        The global ground is even less common. In that sense it's ironic to talk about this as if it's an EU issue. Non-EU/US countries are all completely separate. The EU has much more common ground amongst each other than the other 170 or so countries that aren't EU/US; in that sense, it's an advantage for EU startups compared to startups from the other 170 countries that aren't the US. Yet it gets positioned as this unique EU disadvantage, as "the reason why EU startups are 'behind'".
tacker2000 1y ago
Not needed in the beginning. You can start an UG (mini GmbH) for 1 euro and then convert it into a proper GmbH later.
- badestrand 1y ago
  Technically yes, but it costs thousands per year for upkeep and again thousands plus 1-2 years of time to shut it down again.
- sputr 1y ago
  In countries that have it. In Slovenia we have no such legal entity and so starting a business requires, at the very least, ~400€/month for a single proprietorship (unless you are already employed elsewhere already, then it's <100€) or even more for an LLC-type company (since it requires one fully employed person at a level above minimal wage).
- jcarrano 1y ago
  After waiting 3+ months for the Finanzamt to respond.
deaux 1y ago
I'm sure there's at least one US state where it's a pain to set up a company. So startup founders don't set up in that state but in Delaware, or recently maybe 1-2 ones. Germany is that state for the EU where it's a pain, so you set up your legal entity elsewhere.
bildung 1y ago
You just need to pay 60€ or so for a business license and off you go. A GmbH (a corporate structure with limited liability, somewhere between an LLC and Corp) is not needed if you want to start a) now and b) for almost zero cost.

2.5k EUR in starting capital, and two founders to start a a limited liability company (AB) in Sweden, and a 240 EUR processing fee: https://verksamt.se/starta-foretag/valj-foretagsform/aktiebolag https://verksamt.se/starta-foretag/valj-foretagsform/aktiebo... And you register online.

pier25 1y ago
Depends on the country. Opening a company in Estonia is very cheap but in Spain the manager/CEO needs to be an "autónomo" (like a self-employed tax status). This costs thousands of Euros per year. Something like 2,400-30,000 Euros per year, every year, forever.
- troupo 1y ago
  And that's probably one of the big obstacles in the EU: there's no common ground for these things. At least this will hopefully be addressed: https://www.reuters.com/business/eu-propose-uniform-rules-startups-help-them-grow-von-der-leyen-says-2025-10-03/ https://www.reuters.com/business/eu-propose-uniform-rules-st...
  - vanviegen 1y ago
    What does it matter that the rules for establishing differ per country? I'm only founding in one of them. The article is unclear, but is probably referring to making it easier for startups to offer products in other EU countries.
    - troupo 1y ago
      The idea is to establish common rules to make it easier to register and move startups between countries, among other things. It's in very early stages, so info is very scattered. More info, for example, here: https://www.loyensloeff.com/insights/news--events/news/the-28th-legal-regime-enhancing-european-competitiveness-and-innovation/ https://www.loyensloeff.com/insights/news--events/news/the-2...
  - deaux 1y ago
    So what? There's no common ground in the US either, and it's not an issue there.
    - troupo 1y ago
      The ground is significantly more common than in the EU. And that's just one of the problems (many of the problems have nothing to do with European bureaucracy)
      - deaux 1y ago
        The global ground is even less common. In that sense it's ironic to talk about this as if it's an EU issue. Non-EU/US countries are all completely separate. The EU has much more common ground amongst each other than the other 170 or so countries that aren't EU/US; in that sense, it's an advantage for EU startups compared to startups from the other 170 countries that aren't the US. Yet it gets positioned as this unique EU disadvantage, as "the reason why EU startups are 'behind'".

tacker2000 1y ago

Not needed in the beginning. You can start an UG (mini GmbH) for 1 euro and then convert it into a proper GmbH later.

badestrand 1y ago
Technically yes, but it costs thousands per year for upkeep and again thousands plus 1-2 years of time to shut it down again.
sputr 1y ago
In countries that have it. In Slovenia we have no such legal entity and so starting a business requires, at the very least, ~400€/month for a single proprietorship (unless you are already employed elsewhere already, then it's <100€) or even more for an LLC-type company (since it requires one fully employed person at a level above minimal wage).
jcarrano 1y ago
After waiting 3+ months for the Finanzamt to respond.

deaux 1y ago

I'm sure there's at least one US state where it's a pain to set up a company. So startup founders don't set up in that state but in Delaware, or recently maybe 1-2 ones. Germany is that state for the EU where it's a pain, so you set up your legal entity elsewhere.

bildung 1y ago

You just need to pay 60€ or so for a business license and off you go. A GmbH (a corporate structure with limited liability, somewhere between an LLC and Corp) is not needed if you want to start a) now and b) for almost zero cost.