5 ms·

I took part in application for EU grants a few times and our company group did it many times over the years. It's bureaucracy, often bordering with stupidity.

I took part in application for EU grants a few times and our company group did it many times over the years. It's bureaucracy, often bordering with stupidity. You may need advisors to navigate all their forms & processes. But it certainly isn't "pals-only" type of deal. On the other hand - is it harder than getting VC funding? For seasoned founder with reputation - probably. For fresh startup - probably not.

jll29 1y ago
Reviewer (Scientific Expert) for the EU (since 2009) here. The probability of getting a Horizon Europe grant allegedly (not official stats) is about 8.5% according to some friends, which may seem low. You need to write 70 pages following a Word template and the key goal is to cover answers to a large number of questions. Each proposal gets various grades across a range of dimensions, which get added up and if you obtain at least 13 out of a possible 15 points, you are eligible to get funded, read: "You will get funded if there is enough money." Often, there are several proposals that justly achieve 15/15, and because of that, many prosals that have 14 points and all proposals that have less may not get funded, simply because there just is not enough total funding available to fund all the technically eligible proposals. Having judged many proposals in AI / ML / search / "big data" / language technology etc. I recommend optimizing recall, i.e. aspiring completeness. The application process is not easy, but you can get help: there are support agency in each member country, free online Webinars to help, hotline help desks as well as an ecosystem of paid consultants that typically charge about 3k€ to vet a proposal for you if you need that kind of service (I never used it). The process is neutral and conducted professionally and with external oversight (consultants are hired as "rapporteurs" that report on process/procedural integrity in additional to the actual reviewers). I value the research officers of the EC as people of high competency, integrity and motivation (research money is tax payers money so it should be spent carefully). In comparison, VC (and even more so business angel) funding is achievable with much less formal apparatus, often a short business plan and a convincing slide deck and demo can get people to a partner meeting if the time is right. But the criteria and process are much different, and ideas ready for public research grants are typically too early for VCs (but the EC wants to foster the creation VC-funded startups resulting from the disseminated research).
- alecco 1y ago
  Can you confirm (or not) the mandatory female co-founder? I could swear I read it. Or could it be another EU fund?
  - dzikimarian 1y ago
    None I've seen had such requirement. There's ton of them though, with lot of flexibility on country level.
    - alecco 1y ago
      https://eic.ec.europa.eu/eic-funding-opportunities/eic-accelerator_en#who-can-apply https://eic.ec.europa.eu/eic-funding-opportunities/eic-accel... > The EIC welcomes applications from innovators in all EU Member States and countries associated to the Horizon Europe programme. It particularly welcomes applications from startups and SMEs with female CEOs. So that's one that strongly pushes that angle. But the one I saw I clearly remember saying "female co-founder", not CEO.
  - tacker2000 1y ago
    Some, not all, grant programs cater to female founders or teams with a female.
- jacobgorm 1y ago
  Someone should build a startup that uses the EuroLLM to generate EU funding proposals.
whimsicalism 1y ago
> For fresh startup - probably not. highly doubt, the whole thing about the success of the US west coast is that they are&were willing to fund unproven upstarts.
- array_key_first 1y ago
  Right but if we do this with public funds then the narrative shifts to "OMG the EU is so corrupt and stupid, looking they're pouring taxpayer dollars into unproven stuff! They're deindustrializing!!" The point being that, as soon as public dollars are on the table, people expect perfection. Anything less is waste, fraud, and abuse. There's literally no winning. Want to make sure the money is allocated right? Bureaucracy. Want to not do that? Waste, fraud, and abuse.
  - carlosjobim 1y ago
    The winning move is that governments should do government stuff and private capital should do private capital stuff. Startups belong to the latter.
    - sealeck 1y ago
      > Startups belong to the latter. Except that Apple, Intel, Tesla, etc have all received US government investment [1]. TSMC is a product of the Taiwanese state! Government investment can be done well, and seeds excellent companies. [1]: https://www.sba.gov/blog/2024/2024-02/white-house-sba-announce-landmark-investments-vital-small-businesses-start-ups-through-sbic-program https://www.sba.gov/blog/2024/2024-02/white-house-sba-announ...
      - carlosjobim 1y ago
        It doesn't matter if government funded startups have been successful. It's not the government's job to provide capital to high risk ventures. They should provide public services for the people and regulate the private sector according to the interest of the people.
alecco 1y ago
Someone told me I needed to hire some expensive law firm in Brussels. See: https://www.politico.eu/article/ombudsman-slams-commission-for-secrecy-over-officials-move-to-law-firm/ https://www.politico.eu/article/ombudsman-slams-commission-f...

jll29 1y ago

Reviewer (Scientific Expert) for the EU (since 2009) here. The probability of getting a Horizon Europe grant allegedly (not official stats) is about 8.5% according to some friends, which may seem low. You need to write 70 pages following a Word template and the key goal is to cover answers to a large number of questions. Each proposal gets various grades across a range of dimensions, which get added up and if you obtain at least 13 out of a possible 15 points, you are eligible to get funded, read: "You will get funded if there is enough money." Often, there are several proposals that justly achieve 15/15, and because of that, many prosals that have 14 points and all proposals that have less may not get funded, simply because there just is not enough total funding available to fund all the technically eligible proposals. Having judged many proposals in AI / ML / search / "big data" / language technology etc. I recommend optimizing recall, i.e. aspiring completeness. The application process is not easy, but you can get help: there are support agency in each member country, free online Webinars to help, hotline help desks as well as an ecosystem of paid consultants that typically charge about 3k€ to vet a proposal for you if you need that kind of service (I never used it). The process is neutral and conducted professionally and with external oversight (consultants are hired as "rapporteurs" that report on process/procedural integrity in additional to the actual reviewers). I value the research officers of the EC as people of high competency, integrity and motivation (research money is tax payers money so it should be spent carefully). In comparison, VC (and even more so business angel) funding is achievable with much less formal apparatus, often a short business plan and a convincing slide deck and demo can get people to a partner meeting if the time is right. But the criteria and process are much different, and ideas ready for public research grants are typically too early for VCs (but the EC wants to foster the creation VC-funded startups resulting from the disseminated research).

alecco 1y ago
Can you confirm (or not) the mandatory female co-founder? I could swear I read it. Or could it be another EU fund?
- dzikimarian 1y ago
  None I've seen had such requirement. There's ton of them though, with lot of flexibility on country level.
  - alecco 1y ago
    https://eic.ec.europa.eu/eic-funding-opportunities/eic-accelerator_en#who-can-apply https://eic.ec.europa.eu/eic-funding-opportunities/eic-accel... > The EIC welcomes applications from innovators in all EU Member States and countries associated to the Horizon Europe programme. It particularly welcomes applications from startups and SMEs with female CEOs. So that's one that strongly pushes that angle. But the one I saw I clearly remember saying "female co-founder", not CEO.
- tacker2000 1y ago
  Some, not all, grant programs cater to female founders or teams with a female.
jacobgorm 1y ago
Someone should build a startup that uses the EuroLLM to generate EU funding proposals.

whimsicalism 1y ago

> For fresh startup - probably not. highly doubt, the whole thing about the success of the US west coast is that they are&were willing to fund unproven upstarts.

array_key_first 1y ago
Right but if we do this with public funds then the narrative shifts to "OMG the EU is so corrupt and stupid, looking they're pouring taxpayer dollars into unproven stuff! They're deindustrializing!!" The point being that, as soon as public dollars are on the table, people expect perfection. Anything less is waste, fraud, and abuse. There's literally no winning. Want to make sure the money is allocated right? Bureaucracy. Want to not do that? Waste, fraud, and abuse.
- carlosjobim 1y ago
  The winning move is that governments should do government stuff and private capital should do private capital stuff. Startups belong to the latter.
  - sealeck 1y ago
    > Startups belong to the latter. Except that Apple, Intel, Tesla, etc have all received US government investment [1]. TSMC is a product of the Taiwanese state! Government investment can be done well, and seeds excellent companies. [1]: https://www.sba.gov/blog/2024/2024-02/white-house-sba-announce-landmark-investments-vital-small-businesses-start-ups-through-sbic-program https://www.sba.gov/blog/2024/2024-02/white-house-sba-announ...
    - carlosjobim 1y ago
      It doesn't matter if government funded startups have been successful. It's not the government's job to provide capital to high risk ventures. They should provide public services for the people and regulate the private sector according to the interest of the people.

alecco 1y ago

Someone told me I needed to hire some expensive law firm in Brussels. See: https://www.politico.eu/article/ombudsman-slams-commission-for-secrecy-over-officials-move-to-law-firm/ https://www.politico.eu/article/ombudsman-slams-commission-f...