4 ms·

Only slightly related, but I often try to find ways to fall asleep faster. One thing that seems to work in some situations is trying to imagine a void (like a w

by jansan 1y ago

Only slightly related, but I often try to find ways to fall asleep faster. One thing that seems to work in some situations is trying to imagine a void (like a white or gray plane) for a while. However, often enough this does not work and I wonder if anyone knows of tricks that work for her/him (without using Melantonin or other drugs).

CrimsonCape 1y ago
I have a routine and the crazy part is that it is 100% effective, in that I can be restless, consciously start the routine, and 100% of the time I fall asleep. It is the oddest feeling to begin the routine, which requires conscious mental effort, and suddenly you can't remember anything because you fell asleep. I can only ever recall doing it at times when my mind is racing, so I can't say how well it works when calm as I forget to do the routine when calm. The routine is basically a game to see if you can "flow" between mental images by envisioning scenes in your mind and then allowing some object in the scene to "pull" you into a different scene. For example, envision the power cable of your lamp, you fly along the power cable up to the light bulb, and then you envision the bulb glass exploding into a million pieces, which becomes snow falling on a ski lodge, you see the warm glow of fire in the fireplace, and a fireball blasts out the chimney into the sky, somehow becomes a perfect flaming sphere, that becomes a meatball and falls into a plate of spaghetti, you are eating it down, you see yourself at a ratty diner table, under the table you see your shoes, and then your shoes are running through rain puddles, you zoom into a single droplet which is actually a massive aquarium tank, fish are swimming in it except we are in the ocean, not a tank, and the fish is so colorful but those colors are actually an explosion of rainbow paint colors dripping down an apartment wall, etc. etc. It might sound ridiculous when written in words, but that is the gist of it. The game is to lay there and consciously morph and fly between mental images, letting your mind conjure imagery that comes next. It's crazy because I start doing this with a conscious struggle to envision the next chain-of-events but suddenly my brain catches on and starts unconsciously playing the game and images just kinda flow and BAM asleep.
cube2222 1y ago
Box breathing (2 secs in, 2 secs hold, 2 secs out, 2 secs hold) or meditation both usually help if I can’t fall asleep. Physical exercise during the day also helps.
- skydowx 1y ago
  For me, holding my breath for as long as I can and then releasing it also helps.
Pawamoy 1y ago
A friend shared his technique with me, and after adapting it to my needs, it works well. None of the other commonly mentioned techniques ever worked for me, because they ask for focus, which is the opposite of what my brain needs to fall asleep. Here's his technique: pick a letter of the alphabet, and find as much words that start with this letter as you can. Once you can't find words anymore, pick the next letter. Doesn't work for me, my brain won't ever stop. I noticed I have to visualize stuff in my head to fall asleep so my adaptation is to pick a single letter and a single word, and visualize it in my head, using it, manipulating it, experiencing it, whatever. For example: letter P, word Pineapple, imagine you're holding a pineapple, you feel the roughness of it's skin in your hands, you throw it in the air and catch it again, you take a knife and slice it on a wooden table on the beach, etc.. The dream kicks in seconds. Without external interruptions, after a few minutes I'm asleep (instead of rummaging for hours). If you notice you're stuck in a loop/pattern (for me anything about text, like reading or writing, and voice, like listening and speaking, or stressful scenarios), just pick a new letter, pick a new word, visualize it.
- MarcelOlsz 1y ago
  I live at a 36-hours-at-a-time rhythm and it's absolutely brutal seeing as its 5:30am and I should have been in bed a long time ago. Going to give this a go and report back. I did the lucid dream thing for awhile but holding a heavy object in my hand and then dropping it got quite annoying (to train yourself to be more aware of when you enter a hypnagogic state).
  - dev_hugepages 1y ago
    Non 24h sleep syndrome or something else?
    - MarcelOlsz 1y ago
      Yes. I have no off switch.
- xenocratus 1y ago
  I do something similar. If I'm not anxious but awake, I try to just visualise random stuff, random worlds. Somehow my brain is decent at that and I slowly drift off, though I sometimes get a jolt from reality. Recently I found that when I'm anxious it's better to try and imagine doing a hobby. I just imagine myself trail running. Reduces anxiety, pushes me towards sleep.
goopypoop 1y ago
all I can offer you is an intrusive thought with a song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v64-DpcLEvI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v64-DpcLEvI
paulj5 1y ago
There are a lot of imaging and thought techniques you can use, eg imagine sittimg beside a small stream, while the water guegles by, watch the leaves and sticks flowing past. or imagine events im yoir life floating by, or imagine being a duck floating by, swimming, or flying, etc. There are also body relaxation techniques ( zen , meditation, etc ) There are many many techniques available.
gjadi 1y ago
There are several things I use: - think of past enjoyable moments (for me it's hiking, I usually don't go very far until I fall to sleep) - box breathing - hold breath for N sec then release, then N+10, then ... - try to relax your body from top to bottom (forehead, eyes, cheeks, mouth, ...) - imagine your body is very light, like your floating in the air - imagine your body is very heavy, like a block of concrete sinking into your bed - pick TAOCP and try to solve the exercises ;)
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
IsTom 1y ago
What works for me is to pretend that I'm asleep. And it's good to be able to recognize the first phase of sleep – it's that state that you think that if somebody asked if you're asleep you'd think to yourself "no, I'm not", but have an excuse of "I don't feel like actually talking".
igleria 1y ago
sometimes what works for me is literally inventing a movie in my mind. Then the awake part take the backseat...
AstroNutt 1y ago
Yeah, melatonin makes me feel like crap after a few days of use and it's hit or miss. One thing I've done for years is focus on breathing. Get in a comfortable position and totally relax your body. Slowly take a deep breath. Then exhale until you can't no more. Repeat this 10 or 15 times. For whatever reason, this works for me probably 75% of the time. The other 25%, forget it. On a side note, I'm sure most of us here can relate to this song. https://youtu.be/vaG4vGsIFMQ https://youtu.be/vaG4vGsIFMQ
- jghn 1y ago
  Have you tried smaller doses of melatonin? Can be hard to do as the smallest dosage I usually see at stores is still much higher than what I’ve found to be my max dose
  - ckdarby 1y ago
    Was going to reply the same thing. I buy 1 mg tablets and even that is too much for me. I use a razor blade to cut them into 1/6th pieces. Takes less than 30 minutes to kick in. A lot of other comments here about poor sleep I believe are the result of drinking caffeinated products past 1 PM.
Propelloni 1y ago
What works best for me is to take a book, on paper, preferably on a boring topic (depends on you, obviously) and just start reading. Usually my eyes drop in a matter of minutes. Once I wake up, startled by the book falling over, I kill the lights and go to sleep. Works every time, any time. If I lie in bed and just think stuff, it takes much longer.
- nervousvarun 1y ago
  Seconding this...also works well when I wake up in the middle of the night to get back to sleep which unfortunately seems to happen more and more every year.
- schuyler2d 1y ago
  I do this with audiobooks/podcasts and then can start with the lights off and lying down. (important part I find is making sure the dynamics are low -- no high-volume ads or flashy punctuated sound effects) Not sure if any other buds work like this but the Bose QuietComfort Earbuds seem to auto-pause based on some kind of fitbit/sleep indicator which help even more with staying asleep.
rndmio 1y ago
Sounds trite but my surefire method is to stop thinking. I literally lie down, close my eyes, and stop thinking. Sleep comes quickly.
- jghn 1y ago
  My mom always told me to do this as a child. I’ve never understood this nor any other visualization technique. I have never found this to be possible. At best I actively think about not thinking which is counterproductive but even then within about 10 seconds my mind has already wandered. And if I’m not actively trying I’ll always have some other thoughts popping in no matter what
  - vlod 1y ago
    Something that works for me is count from 10 to 1 slowly. Concentrate getting to 1. If another thought enters, start the count again. Repeat. This is like counting the proverbial sheep.
    - jghn 1y ago
      That's in the same category of techniques that will only work for a very brief time for me. At some point I realize I have background thoughts, and then those take over.
      - vlod 1y ago
        This happens to me as well, but when I become aware of other non welcome thoughts, I just start counting again. /shrug
  - rndmio 1y ago
    It might be because it wasn’t a technique as such. I don’t visualise not thinking, I just stop thinking about things, but I also don’t have a constant inner voice talking to/with me as I understand many people do.
    - 1y ago
oldestofsports 1y ago
I have had sleep issues my whole life, but what works for me is: - Get up same time every day - Moderate excersize every other day - Stable diet, homecooked healthy food and no soda/beer/candy whatsoever. - Dim the lights after dinner - No screens after 8pm (e-ink screens are allowed), no podcasts, no digital content consuming. - Actively aim to be bored everyday - Read a good book before bedtime May sound like a lot, but I sleep now.
- Ylpertnodi 1y ago
  >No screens after 8pm (e-ink screens are allowed), no podcasts, no digital content consuming. Who needs the exception of e-ink screens are OK?
  - oldestofsports 1y ago
    To read books?
JumpCrisscross 1y ago
> trying to imagine a void (like a white or gray plane) for a while Huh, mine is a plane in level flight. (From outside.) Preferably smaller. Depending on my mood it’s retro or like a fighter jet.
tacone 1y ago
On a side note, a good way to check your progress towards falling asleep is looking through your closed eyelids. The more movement (points, lights) you see, the more you're actually close to falling asleep.

by jansan 1y ago

CrimsonCape 1y ago

I have a routine and the crazy part is that it is 100% effective, in that I can be restless, consciously start the routine, and 100% of the time I fall asleep. It is the oddest feeling to begin the routine, which requires conscious mental effort, and suddenly you can't remember anything because you fell asleep. I can only ever recall doing it at times when my mind is racing, so I can't say how well it works when calm as I forget to do the routine when calm. The routine is basically a game to see if you can "flow" between mental images by envisioning scenes in your mind and then allowing some object in the scene to "pull" you into a different scene. For example, envision the power cable of your lamp, you fly along the power cable up to the light bulb, and then you envision the bulb glass exploding into a million pieces, which becomes snow falling on a ski lodge, you see the warm glow of fire in the fireplace, and a fireball blasts out the chimney into the sky, somehow becomes a perfect flaming sphere, that becomes a meatball and falls into a plate of spaghetti, you are eating it down, you see yourself at a ratty diner table, under the table you see your shoes, and then your shoes are running through rain puddles, you zoom into a single droplet which is actually a massive aquarium tank, fish are swimming in it except we are in the ocean, not a tank, and the fish is so colorful but those colors are actually an explosion of rainbow paint colors dripping down an apartment wall, etc. etc. It might sound ridiculous when written in words, but that is the gist of it. The game is to lay there and consciously morph and fly between mental images, letting your mind conjure imagery that comes next. It's crazy because I start doing this with a conscious struggle to envision the next chain-of-events but suddenly my brain catches on and starts unconsciously playing the game and images just kinda flow and BAM asleep.

cube2222 1y ago

Box breathing (2 secs in, 2 secs hold, 2 secs out, 2 secs hold) or meditation both usually help if I can’t fall asleep. Physical exercise during the day also helps.

skydowx 1y ago
For me, holding my breath for as long as I can and then releasing it also helps.

Pawamoy 1y ago

A friend shared his technique with me, and after adapting it to my needs, it works well. None of the other commonly mentioned techniques ever worked for me, because they ask for focus, which is the opposite of what my brain needs to fall asleep. Here's his technique: pick a letter of the alphabet, and find as much words that start with this letter as you can. Once you can't find words anymore, pick the next letter. Doesn't work for me, my brain won't ever stop. I noticed I have to visualize stuff in my head to fall asleep so my adaptation is to pick a single letter and a single word, and visualize it in my head, using it, manipulating it, experiencing it, whatever. For example: letter P, word Pineapple, imagine you're holding a pineapple, you feel the roughness of it's skin in your hands, you throw it in the air and catch it again, you take a knife and slice it on a wooden table on the beach, etc.. The dream kicks in seconds. Without external interruptions, after a few minutes I'm asleep (instead of rummaging for hours). If you notice you're stuck in a loop/pattern (for me anything about text, like reading or writing, and voice, like listening and speaking, or stressful scenarios), just pick a new letter, pick a new word, visualize it.

MarcelOlsz 1y ago
I live at a 36-hours-at-a-time rhythm and it's absolutely brutal seeing as its 5:30am and I should have been in bed a long time ago. Going to give this a go and report back. I did the lucid dream thing for awhile but holding a heavy object in my hand and then dropping it got quite annoying (to train yourself to be more aware of when you enter a hypnagogic state).
- dev_hugepages 1y ago
  Non 24h sleep syndrome or something else?
  - MarcelOlsz 1y ago
    Yes. I have no off switch.
xenocratus 1y ago
I do something similar. If I'm not anxious but awake, I try to just visualise random stuff, random worlds. Somehow my brain is decent at that and I slowly drift off, though I sometimes get a jolt from reality. Recently I found that when I'm anxious it's better to try and imagine doing a hobby. I just imagine myself trail running. Reduces anxiety, pushes me towards sleep.

goopypoop 1y ago

all I can offer you is an intrusive thought with a song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v64-DpcLEvI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v64-DpcLEvI

paulj5 1y ago

There are a lot of imaging and thought techniques you can use, eg imagine sittimg beside a small stream, while the water guegles by, watch the leaves and sticks flowing past. or imagine events im yoir life floating by, or imagine being a duck floating by, swimming, or flying, etc. There are also body relaxation techniques ( zen , meditation, etc ) There are many many techniques available.

gjadi 1y ago

There are several things I use: - think of past enjoyable moments (for me it's hiking, I usually don't go very far until I fall to sleep) - box breathing - hold breath for N sec then release, then N+10, then ... - try to relax your body from top to bottom (forehead, eyes, cheeks, mouth, ...) - imagine your body is very light, like your floating in the air - imagine your body is very heavy, like a block of concrete sinking into your bed - pick TAOCP and try to solve the exercises ;)

deleted 1y ago
[deleted]

IsTom 1y ago

What works for me is to pretend that I'm asleep. And it's good to be able to recognize the first phase of sleep – it's that state that you think that if somebody asked if you're asleep you'd think to yourself "no, I'm not", but have an excuse of "I don't feel like actually talking".

igleria 1y ago

sometimes what works for me is literally inventing a movie in my mind. Then the awake part take the backseat...

AstroNutt 1y ago

Yeah, melatonin makes me feel like crap after a few days of use and it's hit or miss. One thing I've done for years is focus on breathing. Get in a comfortable position and totally relax your body. Slowly take a deep breath. Then exhale until you can't no more. Repeat this 10 or 15 times. For whatever reason, this works for me probably 75% of the time. The other 25%, forget it. On a side note, I'm sure most of us here can relate to this song. https://youtu.be/vaG4vGsIFMQ https://youtu.be/vaG4vGsIFMQ

jghn 1y ago
Have you tried smaller doses of melatonin? Can be hard to do as the smallest dosage I usually see at stores is still much higher than what I’ve found to be my max dose
- ckdarby 1y ago
  Was going to reply the same thing. I buy 1 mg tablets and even that is too much for me. I use a razor blade to cut them into 1/6th pieces. Takes less than 30 minutes to kick in. A lot of other comments here about poor sleep I believe are the result of drinking caffeinated products past 1 PM.

Propelloni 1y ago

What works best for me is to take a book, on paper, preferably on a boring topic (depends on you, obviously) and just start reading. Usually my eyes drop in a matter of minutes. Once I wake up, startled by the book falling over, I kill the lights and go to sleep. Works every time, any time. If I lie in bed and just think stuff, it takes much longer.

nervousvarun 1y ago
Seconding this...also works well when I wake up in the middle of the night to get back to sleep which unfortunately seems to happen more and more every year.
schuyler2d 1y ago
I do this with audiobooks/podcasts and then can start with the lights off and lying down. (important part I find is making sure the dynamics are low -- no high-volume ads or flashy punctuated sound effects) Not sure if any other buds work like this but the Bose QuietComfort Earbuds seem to auto-pause based on some kind of fitbit/sleep indicator which help even more with staying asleep.

rndmio 1y ago

Sounds trite but my surefire method is to stop thinking. I literally lie down, close my eyes, and stop thinking. Sleep comes quickly.

jghn 1y ago
My mom always told me to do this as a child. I’ve never understood this nor any other visualization technique. I have never found this to be possible. At best I actively think about not thinking which is counterproductive but even then within about 10 seconds my mind has already wandered. And if I’m not actively trying I’ll always have some other thoughts popping in no matter what
- vlod 1y ago
  Something that works for me is count from 10 to 1 slowly. Concentrate getting to 1. If another thought enters, start the count again. Repeat. This is like counting the proverbial sheep.
  - jghn 1y ago
    That's in the same category of techniques that will only work for a very brief time for me. At some point I realize I have background thoughts, and then those take over.
    - vlod 1y ago
      This happens to me as well, but when I become aware of other non welcome thoughts, I just start counting again. /shrug
- rndmio 1y ago
  It might be because it wasn’t a technique as such. I don’t visualise not thinking, I just stop thinking about things, but I also don’t have a constant inner voice talking to/with me as I understand many people do.
  - 1y ago

oldestofsports 1y ago

I have had sleep issues my whole life, but what works for me is: - Get up same time every day - Moderate excersize every other day - Stable diet, homecooked healthy food and no soda/beer/candy whatsoever. - Dim the lights after dinner - No screens after 8pm (e-ink screens are allowed), no podcasts, no digital content consuming. - Actively aim to be bored everyday - Read a good book before bedtime May sound like a lot, but I sleep now.

Ylpertnodi 1y ago
>No screens after 8pm (e-ink screens are allowed), no podcasts, no digital content consuming. Who needs the exception of e-ink screens are OK?
- oldestofsports 1y ago
  To read books?

JumpCrisscross 1y ago

> trying to imagine a void (like a white or gray plane) for a while Huh, mine is a plane in level flight. (From outside.) Preferably smaller. Depending on my mood it’s retro or like a fighter jet.

tacone 1y ago

On a side note, a good way to check your progress towards falling asleep is looking through your closed eyelids. The more movement (points, lights) you see, the more you're actually close to falling asleep.