3 ms·

Lie or not, what constructive difference does it make?

by AznHisoka 1y ago

gadflyinyoureye 1y ago
US voters can demand policy change. We have to have a political movement to stem the corruption.
- AznHisoka 1y ago
  Well i dont have much faith in politicians…
  - gadflyinyoureye 1y ago
    That's where genz and millennials come in. We need to put aside our differences on a great many thing to organize around building a better future for the US.
    - brazukadev 1y ago
      The last time a group of idealist people tried to do that they created Facebook, airbnb, uber.
jimbo808 1y ago
It prevents Americans from noticing and voting in response to the actual problem, which is an aggressive and systematic effort to undercut American wages at all levels of the working class, with immigrants, both legal and non-legal. They've been trying to blame it on AI, and when that doesn't work, they call you a racist (conveniently ignoring that Americans are not all one race).
- marcuskane2 1y ago
  Man, your anger is just pointed in the wrong direction here. Be mad at the CEO & hedge fund managers making millions of dollars a year by exploiting the working classes, who will happily move all the jobs overseas tomorrow if they can't hire in America. Not your fellow worker who was born on the other side of an imaginary line. You're not losing wealth because of the Honduran guy mowing your neighbor's grass. You're losing wealth because the top 1% is accumulating an ever larger share of total wealth.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
  - jimbo808 1y ago
    Can you quote a any specific portion of my comment from which you inferred anger? Also, do you not understand that reducing an American person’s wages, by having a Honduran guy come into the country and do his job for half the price, then use that to compete with him for an apartment, increasing his cost of living, and reducing the money Big Corp, Inc has to spend on labor, is a direct transfer of wealth out of your pocket, and into their pockets. It’s one of many ways rampant immigration is a war on the middle class, and yes, it is Big Corp, Inc, and the institutions that own it, who are doing this. I am not angry at the Honduran. I am critical of the people who gaslight us into thinking that allowing him and millions like him to come here and work for less money than their American counterparts, is somehow good for us. People will say Americans don’t want those jobs. But here’s the rub - Americans did want those jobs, back when they paid enough to support a family. Americans also do want trucking jobs, and tech jobs, and medical jobs, and all jobs. And we’re forced to do them for a vanishingly small wage, while we watch our futures disappear, and the hope of ever securing financial security disappears.
    - marcuskane2 1y ago
      > by having a Honduran guy come into the country and do his job for half the price, then use that to compete with him for an apartment, increasing his cost of living So the immigrants are making half the income, but also paying more for rent? So your thesis rests on the notion that the Honduran is paying like 80% of his income in rent? Feels... unlikely.
      - jimbo808 1y ago
        This is pretty straightforward economics. The Honduran guy doesn’t need to compete directly with him for housing to contribute to an overall increase in the cost of housing. I assume you are an adult, and since you’re on Hacker News, you’re probably an educated one. It’s crazy to me that I would have to explain such a basic economic concept to an educated adult.

Lie or not, what constructive difference does it make?

gadflyinyoureye 1y ago

US voters can demand policy change. We have to have a political movement to stem the corruption.

AznHisoka 1y ago
Well i dont have much faith in politicians…
- gadflyinyoureye 1y ago
  That's where genz and millennials come in. We need to put aside our differences on a great many thing to organize around building a better future for the US.
  - brazukadev 1y ago
    The last time a group of idealist people tried to do that they created Facebook, airbnb, uber.

jimbo808 1y ago

It prevents Americans from noticing and voting in response to the actual problem, which is an aggressive and systematic effort to undercut American wages at all levels of the working class, with immigrants, both legal and non-legal. They've been trying to blame it on AI, and when that doesn't work, they call you a racist (conveniently ignoring that Americans are not all one race).

marcuskane2 1y ago
Man, your anger is just pointed in the wrong direction here. Be mad at the CEO & hedge fund managers making millions of dollars a year by exploiting the working classes, who will happily move all the jobs overseas tomorrow if they can't hire in America. Not your fellow worker who was born on the other side of an imaginary line. You're not losing wealth because of the Honduran guy mowing your neighbor's grass. You're losing wealth because the top 1% is accumulating an ever larger share of total wealth.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- jimbo808 1y ago
  Can you quote a any specific portion of my comment from which you inferred anger? Also, do you not understand that reducing an American person’s wages, by having a Honduran guy come into the country and do his job for half the price, then use that to compete with him for an apartment, increasing his cost of living, and reducing the money Big Corp, Inc has to spend on labor, is a direct transfer of wealth out of your pocket, and into their pockets. It’s one of many ways rampant immigration is a war on the middle class, and yes, it is Big Corp, Inc, and the institutions that own it, who are doing this. I am not angry at the Honduran. I am critical of the people who gaslight us into thinking that allowing him and millions like him to come here and work for less money than their American counterparts, is somehow good for us. People will say Americans don’t want those jobs. But here’s the rub - Americans did want those jobs, back when they paid enough to support a family. Americans also do want trucking jobs, and tech jobs, and medical jobs, and all jobs. And we’re forced to do them for a vanishingly small wage, while we watch our futures disappear, and the hope of ever securing financial security disappears.
  - marcuskane2 1y ago
    > by having a Honduran guy come into the country and do his job for half the price, then use that to compete with him for an apartment, increasing his cost of living So the immigrants are making half the income, but also paying more for rent? So your thesis rests on the notion that the Honduran is paying like 80% of his income in rent? Feels... unlikely.
    - jimbo808 1y ago
      This is pretty straightforward economics. The Honduran guy doesn’t need to compete directly with him for housing to contribute to an overall increase in the cost of housing. I assume you are an adult, and since you’re on Hacker News, you’re probably an educated one. It’s crazy to me that I would have to explain such a basic economic concept to an educated adult.