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Hacker News is a little hard in these times. That it has kept politics unrelated to tech out is a great achievement, but as scientific method is being equated t

by vvpan 1y ago

Hacker News is a little hard in these times. That it has kept politics unrelated to tech out is a great achievement, but as scientific method is being equated to flat-earth thinking by elected leaders talking about what's new in Rust seems off.

ChrisRR 1y ago
I really hope it doesn't become the norm. Check r/technology on reddit and it's 90% US politics posts
bix6 1y ago
I understand the frustration but the people on this board have real ability to make change so I think it’s worthwhile.
Rebuff5007 1y ago
> That it has kept politics unrelated to tech out is a great achievement I see your point, but is it an achievement? Is there not some amount of civil rights abuse or a breakdown of society that would warrant discussion on all possible spaces? I say this as someone that feels conflicted to see a daily twitter feed of tech leaders celebrating the performance of their favorite LLM breaking some new record when citizens and residents are being detained or discriminated against in violent and appalling ways... sometimes just meters from a fancy tech office!
- tinfoilhatter 1y ago
  Many of those tech "leaders", who are celebrating the performance of their favorite LLM are also large donors to politicians who are enabling the violent abuses of power you mentioned. I don't feel conflicted, because we're seeing exactly what they want to play out, play out.
- Esophagus4 1y ago
  Can I make a distinction of separating politics (especially US politics) from current affairs? Shining a light on current affairs, sure. It’s nice to engage with those on this site. I get just as tired of seeing the same posts about LLMs and the Ai BuBbLe as you do. And there are some political stories that are probably worth the real estate here. But where I’ll draw a distinction is that there will always be a political story grabbing attention on social media. And someone will always be outraged enough about it to deem it important enough for your outrage as well. For example, I’m sure there are people who would say this is important news: “politician responds to other people who respond to Trump’s ballroom construction”[1]. If we don’t have some line on politics specifically (because that has proven to be engagement-bait high-sugar content for the internet), we will end up with a lot of low quality content here and less interesting / focused discussion with the people that make this site interesting. Someone will always think every political story is important enough for discussion, but I think it’s healthy to keep HN free of most of it. Most of the low hanging, high-sugar fruit, at least. [1] https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/5566872-donald-trump-white-house-renovation-east-wing/ https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/5566872-donald-trump-whi...
oceanplexian 1y ago
I guess doctors, scientists, and politicians are going to need to stop pretending COVID never happened then and acknowledge the massive loss in public trust that resulted in the pendulum swinging the other way. I'm talking the mandates pushed by "experts" to force young K-12 students (Like my sister) into remote schooling that had profound impacts on their social life and education. Or when California arrested people for going to a beach or a public park based on the advice of their respective health experts. Or when Nevada closed Churches, but not Liquor Stores and Pot Dispensaries, because the experts had decided Constitutional Rights weren't an essential activity. Perhaps when those mistakes are acknowledged things can go back to normal.
- redserk 1y ago
  Who’s pretending COVID didn’t happen?
  - quentindanjou 1y ago
    I think it was more meant as the society is ignoring it like a trauma that no one wants to talk about. This results in missing learnings on decisions that were taken back then.
- ceejayoz 1y ago
  > Or when Nevada closed Churches, but not Liquor Stores and Pot Dispensaries, because the experts had decided Constitutional Rights weren't an essential activity. People die from alcohol withdrawal, and dispensaries are medical care for a lot of folks.
  - mindslight 1y ago
    > People die from alcohol withdrawal, and dispensaries are medical care for a lot of folks. This is the exact type of argument that merely helped to inflame the debate. The real distinction is that church services are mass gatherings of people, whereas liquor and pot are retail establishments that only serve a few people at a given time. Stores can institute policies to make people come into even less contact - whereas for churches the mass of people coming together is intrinsic. The original argument fallaciously skips over that actual reality, and frames it as if public health administrators are godless heathens more interested in people getting their weed and booze than people going to church. Your counter argument, despite being technically correct, actually buttresses support for the original one.
vitalredundancy 1y ago
The distinction that there are separable and unrelated domains of knowledge and activity is a kind of Fordism of the mind that our current society has impressed upon us. It's artificial to not talk about politics in the same breath as science, since science and technology produce the resources that make our political process for distribution of those resources necessary. I think this is a correction for an aberrant distinction in our thinking.
- Jensson 1y ago
  > It's artificial to not talk about politics in the same breath as science No its not, its weird to talk about politics without science, but its not weird to be interested science without wanting to care about politics.
thaw13579 1y ago
It's especially hard given that big tech companies and their leaders are working closely with government and explicitly supporting certain political missions, there are few truly apolitical corners of tech now.
- vvpan 1y ago
  That is a very good point. The big tech leaders have politically soiled the industry.
duxup 1y ago
It was easier when "politics" and typical tech news overlapped now and then but not endlessly. You could filter ... Now the culture wars and loyalty tests of the current government occur just about everywhere. There is no limit to the scope of topics that are part of the test, no objection will be tolerated. Any objection means you're <insert buzzword here>. We're nearing the point where your point of view might even limit your choice of college (or maybe any college) if the president gets his way.

by vvpan 1y ago

ChrisRR 1y ago

I really hope it doesn't become the norm. Check r/technology on reddit and it's 90% US politics posts

bix6 1y ago

I understand the frustration but the people on this board have real ability to make change so I think it’s worthwhile.

Rebuff5007 1y ago

> That it has kept politics unrelated to tech out is a great achievement I see your point, but is it an achievement? Is there not some amount of civil rights abuse or a breakdown of society that would warrant discussion on all possible spaces? I say this as someone that feels conflicted to see a daily twitter feed of tech leaders celebrating the performance of their favorite LLM breaking some new record when citizens and residents are being detained or discriminated against in violent and appalling ways... sometimes just meters from a fancy tech office!

tinfoilhatter 1y ago
Many of those tech "leaders", who are celebrating the performance of their favorite LLM are also large donors to politicians who are enabling the violent abuses of power you mentioned. I don't feel conflicted, because we're seeing exactly what they want to play out, play out.
Esophagus4 1y ago
Can I make a distinction of separating politics (especially US politics) from current affairs? Shining a light on current affairs, sure. It’s nice to engage with those on this site. I get just as tired of seeing the same posts about LLMs and the Ai BuBbLe as you do. And there are some political stories that are probably worth the real estate here. But where I’ll draw a distinction is that there will always be a political story grabbing attention on social media. And someone will always be outraged enough about it to deem it important enough for your outrage as well. For example, I’m sure there are people who would say this is important news: “politician responds to other people who respond to Trump’s ballroom construction”[1]. If we don’t have some line on politics specifically (because that has proven to be engagement-bait high-sugar content for the internet), we will end up with a lot of low quality content here and less interesting / focused discussion with the people that make this site interesting. Someone will always think every political story is important enough for discussion, but I think it’s healthy to keep HN free of most of it. Most of the low hanging, high-sugar fruit, at least. [1] https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/5566872-donald-trump-white-house-renovation-east-wing/ https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/5566872-donald-trump-whi...

oceanplexian 1y ago

I guess doctors, scientists, and politicians are going to need to stop pretending COVID never happened then and acknowledge the massive loss in public trust that resulted in the pendulum swinging the other way. I'm talking the mandates pushed by "experts" to force young K-12 students (Like my sister) into remote schooling that had profound impacts on their social life and education. Or when California arrested people for going to a beach or a public park based on the advice of their respective health experts. Or when Nevada closed Churches, but not Liquor Stores and Pot Dispensaries, because the experts had decided Constitutional Rights weren't an essential activity. Perhaps when those mistakes are acknowledged things can go back to normal.

redserk 1y ago
Who’s pretending COVID didn’t happen?
- quentindanjou 1y ago
  I think it was more meant as the society is ignoring it like a trauma that no one wants to talk about. This results in missing learnings on decisions that were taken back then.
ceejayoz 1y ago
> Or when Nevada closed Churches, but not Liquor Stores and Pot Dispensaries, because the experts had decided Constitutional Rights weren't an essential activity. People die from alcohol withdrawal, and dispensaries are medical care for a lot of folks.
- mindslight 1y ago
  > People die from alcohol withdrawal, and dispensaries are medical care for a lot of folks. This is the exact type of argument that merely helped to inflame the debate. The real distinction is that church services are mass gatherings of people, whereas liquor and pot are retail establishments that only serve a few people at a given time. Stores can institute policies to make people come into even less contact - whereas for churches the mass of people coming together is intrinsic. The original argument fallaciously skips over that actual reality, and frames it as if public health administrators are godless heathens more interested in people getting their weed and booze than people going to church. Your counter argument, despite being technically correct, actually buttresses support for the original one.

vitalredundancy 1y ago

The distinction that there are separable and unrelated domains of knowledge and activity is a kind of Fordism of the mind that our current society has impressed upon us. It's artificial to not talk about politics in the same breath as science, since science and technology produce the resources that make our political process for distribution of those resources necessary. I think this is a correction for an aberrant distinction in our thinking.

Jensson 1y ago
> It's artificial to not talk about politics in the same breath as science No its not, its weird to talk about politics without science, but its not weird to be interested science without wanting to care about politics.

thaw13579 1y ago

It's especially hard given that big tech companies and their leaders are working closely with government and explicitly supporting certain political missions, there are few truly apolitical corners of tech now.

vvpan 1y ago
That is a very good point. The big tech leaders have politically soiled the industry.

duxup 1y ago

It was easier when "politics" and typical tech news overlapped now and then but not endlessly. You could filter ... Now the culture wars and loyalty tests of the current government occur just about everywhere. There is no limit to the scope of topics that are part of the test, no objection will be tolerated. Any objection means you're <insert buzzword here>. We're nearing the point where your point of view might even limit your choice of college (or maybe any college) if the president gets his way.