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> would you feel common ground with a predatory fish? Or a plant? An insect colony? Yes. Humans famously show compassion for all of these. I don't think allig

> would you feel common ground with a predatory fish? Or a plant? An insect colony? Yes. Humans famously show compassion for all of these. I don't think alligators co-evolved with Steve Irwin. Humans even show compassion for rocks and non-living things. We show compassion for the literal ground. We anthropomorphize it. Is this anthropomorphization not an attempt to understand and have compassion. Regardless, you just asked how OP feels. I don't know how they do, but I can say how I do. "Yes"

circlefavshape 1y ago
In my cutlery drawer we have a couple of mismatched forks, and one of them in particular is weird-looking. Somehow I don't like saying that it's weird-looking if it can "hear" me (i.e. if it's on the table rather than in the drawer)
lelanthran 1y ago
>> would you feel common ground with a predatory fish? Or a plant? An insect colony? > Yes. > Humans famously show compassion for all of these. But alligators rarely show compassion for humans, barracudas are not known for saving drowning babies and plants frequently show no compassion to anything. IOW, Alien life might resemble alligator mindsets more than human ones. We don't know.
- swiftcoder 1y ago
  > But alligators rarely show compassion for humans, barracudas are not known for saving drowning babies and plants frequently show no compassion to anything. On the other hand, even predatory mammals are documented on occasion to render aid to humans (i.e. dolphins rescuing humans from drowning, or intervening in shark attacks), and in domestic settings can be convinced to raise young from other species (domestic cats/dogs will raise most baby animals if introduced correctly). It's not as cut and dried as a hard species boundary on compassion.
  - godelski 1y ago
    Not to mention that traveling interstellar distances requires the work of multiple lifeforms working in conjunction. Which requires some form of compassion, slavery, or a really really intelligent and long living creature that is able to survey the land, smelt the materials, machine every screw, and build an interstellar spaceship. Even if it knew how to do such a thing, the time alone would be astronomical, so it really reduces the odds. Compassion seems just a natural evolutionary direction as it is far more energy efficient for creatures to form coalitions.
    - lelanthran 1y ago
      > Compassion seems just a natural evolutionary direction as it is far more energy efficient for creatures to form coalitions. Coalitions within the species (family unit, clan, pack, etc), sure. Coalitions with external parties? That's rare outside of concurrent intertwined evolution (symbiotic relationships, parasitic relationships, etc).
      - swiftcoder 1y ago
        We have a sample size of one, when it comes to self-aware sentient species, so I'm not sure we can draw any reasonable conclusions about likelihood of empathy between two such species
        lelanthran 1y ago
        > We have a sample size of one, when it comes to self-aware sentient species, so I'm not sure we can draw any reasonable conclusions about likelihood of empathy between two such species I'm not; I'm only pointing out that the conclusions I see ITT expressing the notion that a more intelligent species would necessarily be more compassionate is more unlikely than the converse, because from our one and only sample of life, we don't see it often. IOW, I am replying "We don't know that" to the assertion "They will be compassionate.".
        1y ago
Kiboneu 1y ago
If you spend some time in nature, you’ll also feel how cruel and alien it can be.

circlefavshape 1y ago

In my cutlery drawer we have a couple of mismatched forks, and one of them in particular is weird-looking. Somehow I don't like saying that it's weird-looking if it can "hear" me (i.e. if it's on the table rather than in the drawer)

lelanthran 1y ago

>> would you feel common ground with a predatory fish? Or a plant? An insect colony? > Yes. > Humans famously show compassion for all of these. But alligators rarely show compassion for humans, barracudas are not known for saving drowning babies and plants frequently show no compassion to anything. IOW, Alien life might resemble alligator mindsets more than human ones. We don't know.

swiftcoder 1y ago
> But alligators rarely show compassion for humans, barracudas are not known for saving drowning babies and plants frequently show no compassion to anything. On the other hand, even predatory mammals are documented on occasion to render aid to humans (i.e. dolphins rescuing humans from drowning, or intervening in shark attacks), and in domestic settings can be convinced to raise young from other species (domestic cats/dogs will raise most baby animals if introduced correctly). It's not as cut and dried as a hard species boundary on compassion.
- godelski 1y ago
  Not to mention that traveling interstellar distances requires the work of multiple lifeforms working in conjunction. Which requires some form of compassion, slavery, or a really really intelligent and long living creature that is able to survey the land, smelt the materials, machine every screw, and build an interstellar spaceship. Even if it knew how to do such a thing, the time alone would be astronomical, so it really reduces the odds. Compassion seems just a natural evolutionary direction as it is far more energy efficient for creatures to form coalitions.
  - lelanthran 1y ago
    > Compassion seems just a natural evolutionary direction as it is far more energy efficient for creatures to form coalitions. Coalitions within the species (family unit, clan, pack, etc), sure. Coalitions with external parties? That's rare outside of concurrent intertwined evolution (symbiotic relationships, parasitic relationships, etc).
    - swiftcoder 1y ago
      We have a sample size of one, when it comes to self-aware sentient species, so I'm not sure we can draw any reasonable conclusions about likelihood of empathy between two such species
      - lelanthran 1y ago
        > We have a sample size of one, when it comes to self-aware sentient species, so I'm not sure we can draw any reasonable conclusions about likelihood of empathy between two such species I'm not; I'm only pointing out that the conclusions I see ITT expressing the notion that a more intelligent species would necessarily be more compassionate is more unlikely than the converse, because from our one and only sample of life, we don't see it often. IOW, I am replying "We don't know that" to the assertion "They will be compassionate.".
        1y ago

Kiboneu 1y ago

If you spend some time in nature, you’ll also feel how cruel and alien it can be.