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> Also, turning off internet connections means less-capable remote shut shut-off. Why does it have to be remote what's wrong with it being in-house? Besides a

> Also, turning off internet connections means less-capable remote shut shut-off. Why does it have to be remote what's wrong with it being in-house? Besides a shut-off should never be able to be triggered remotely. The same goes for digital emergency shut off buttons; all should be physical. > Less-responsive power plants. What? How is remote any more responsive than physical workers being in-house? If power-plants operated efficiently back in the 50's without internet, they should be able to now without internet.

JumpCrisscross 1y ago
> Why does it have to be remote what's wrong with it being in-house? Nothing wrong with it being in house. But having a back-up is never bad. > How is remote any more responsive than physical workers being in-house? If the on-site workers are incapacitated. It's a remote (hehe) risk. But so is foreign hackers doing anything with our nukes. > If power-plants operated efficiently back in the 50's without internet, they should be able to now without internet If you're fine paying 50s power prices again, sure, I'm sure a power company would happily run their plants retro style.
- IAmBroom 1y ago
  > But having a back-up is never bad. It is always an increase in risk, in a security sense.
- tehjoker 1y ago
  good argument against having nukes
  - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
    One can paraphrase the joke about democracy for nukes. Having nukes is the worst, other than every situation where you don’t have nukes and the other guy does.
    - tehjoker 1y ago
      Most of the other guys get nukes because we have nukes and threaten them militarily. They're very expensive, countries don't want them unless they need a deterrent, and we're often the main threat.
- fragmede 1y ago
  > When expressed in constant 2019 dollars, the average price of electricity in the United States fell from $4.79 per kilowatt-hour in 1902 (the first year for which the national mean is available) to 32 cents in 1950. https://spectrum.ieee.org/electricity-its-wonderfully-affordable-but-its-no-longer-getting-any-cheaper https://spectrum.ieee.org/electricity-its-wonderfully-afford... $0.32 is $0.41 accoreit BLS, which is less than I'm paying today (I live somewhere with expensive electricity), so I'd enjoy the discount if they did! https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=0.32&year1=201901&year2=202508 https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=0.32&year1=201...
  - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
    > $0.32 is $0.41 accoreit BLS, which is less than I'm paying today Out of curiosity, what was the real power price where you live in the 60s?
    - fragmede 1y ago
      Had a long back-and-forth with ChatGPT and it says, accounting for inflation, that it's roughly the same from the 50s and the 60s versus today.
HippyTed 1y ago
The one exception I can think of is remote shutdown in the face of a rapid natural disaster. Like how the japanese train network is set to shut down rapidly when a high power quake is detected. But that is very geography dependant.

JumpCrisscross 1y ago

> Why does it have to be remote what's wrong with it being in-house? Nothing wrong with it being in house. But having a back-up is never bad. > How is remote any more responsive than physical workers being in-house? If the on-site workers are incapacitated. It's a remote (hehe) risk. But so is foreign hackers doing anything with our nukes. > If power-plants operated efficiently back in the 50's without internet, they should be able to now without internet If you're fine paying 50s power prices again, sure, I'm sure a power company would happily run their plants retro style.

IAmBroom 1y ago
> But having a back-up is never bad. It is always an increase in risk, in a security sense.
tehjoker 1y ago
good argument against having nukes
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
  One can paraphrase the joke about democracy for nukes. Having nukes is the worst, other than every situation where you don’t have nukes and the other guy does.
  - tehjoker 1y ago
    Most of the other guys get nukes because we have nukes and threaten them militarily. They're very expensive, countries don't want them unless they need a deterrent, and we're often the main threat.
fragmede 1y ago
> When expressed in constant 2019 dollars, the average price of electricity in the United States fell from $4.79 per kilowatt-hour in 1902 (the first year for which the national mean is available) to 32 cents in 1950. https://spectrum.ieee.org/electricity-its-wonderfully-affordable-but-its-no-longer-getting-any-cheaper https://spectrum.ieee.org/electricity-its-wonderfully-afford... $0.32 is $0.41 accoreit BLS, which is less than I'm paying today (I live somewhere with expensive electricity), so I'd enjoy the discount if they did! https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=0.32&year1=201901&year2=202508 https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=0.32&year1=201...
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
  > $0.32 is $0.41 accoreit BLS, which is less than I'm paying today Out of curiosity, what was the real power price where you live in the 60s?
  - fragmede 1y ago
    Had a long back-and-forth with ChatGPT and it says, accounting for inflation, that it's roughly the same from the 50s and the 60s versus today.

HippyTed 1y ago

The one exception I can think of is remote shutdown in the face of a rapid natural disaster. Like how the japanese train network is set to shut down rapidly when a high power quake is detected. But that is very geography dependant.