4 ms·

Remind me why we need to get to the moon again?

by dtj1123 1y ago

JKCalhoun 1y ago
China will remind us soon enough.
voidUpdate 1y ago
The first time was to beat the soviets. This time is to beat china
philipwhiuk 1y ago
American Republicans have invented that it's in a race with China even though it's already been and it's not clear China thinks it's a race.
- notahacker 1y ago
  I suspect China thinks that dominance of space comes with superior research capability, and are delighted that the current US government is doing everything it can to sabotage that whilst fixating on a symbolic achievement which shouldn't really matter much to the US...
nilamo 1y ago
Why must there be a NEED? Why did we ever send ships across the ocean to explore? Where was the need? People like doing science, and so we're doing science.
- pfdietz 1y ago
  That was (for the western hemisphere) mostly to steal gold and silver from other civilizations. Oh, and to grow addictive drugs for export, like in Virginia. It was never done for other than banal reasons, although I'm sure pious rationalizations were offered to make people feel better about the ongoing genocides.
  - kreetx 1y ago
    Wasn't it to discover alternative trade routes and also to show physically that the world is round? I think they didn't know that there were usable land to grow tobacco when they started.
    - mrguyorama 1y ago
      Humans have demonstrably known the world is round since at least ancient Greece. Columbus claimed it was radically smaller in diameter than previous calculations, and was begging for funding to go around the other side of the world to get a good trade route to India and China for trade goods. He was following some bad math, and adding his own worse math to the mix. People were sure he was going to die, because they did not bring enough provisions to actually go around the world.
      - pfdietz 1y ago
        Amusingly, Spain famously did set up trade to China through the New World. Silver was mined in South America and taken to China (or to the Philippines), traded for silk and other luxury goods, which were then taken back across the Pacific, over land to the Atlantic, and then on to Europe. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manila_galleon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manila_galleon
    - pfdietz 1y ago
      The first of those is banal, and the second is wrong -- they already knew the world was round, and had a more accurate estimate of the diameter than Columbus was claiming.
      - kreetx 1y ago
        Round, they knew, but still, to do it physically, was still somehow important - even for those who paid for it. Banal, depends on what you mean by this word.
  - nilamo 1y ago
    That feels like a bit of rewriting the past. How could someone plan on stealing valuables from somewhere across the ocean... before they know there even is an "across the ocean" to get to? It also feels quite off to reduce all of human curiosity to a means of getting one over on someone.
pfdietz 1y ago
So we can delay dealing with the complete unrealism of our expectations of the future.
IAmBroom 1y ago
1. To avoid discussing Epstein. 2. The masses need circuses. As for bread, Marie Antoinette's press secretary said it best. 3. Trump thinks he'll corner the market on cheese.
kulahan 1y ago
For a serious answer: it's a lot cheaper to launch rockets from there, and we're running out of stuff to do in the region immediately surrounding Earth.
- henryfjordan 1y ago
  Is it? You have a build a whole fuel refinery on the Moon before it's worth even thinking about. And even then, you have to get whatever you want to launch to the moon in the first place...
  - kulahan 1y ago
    Building the fuel refinery is a high upfront cost which will quickly disappear. The delta-V required to exit Earth's surface is nearly an order of magnitude higher than what's required to exit the Moon's surface, and the moon is full of fuel.
actionfromafar 1y ago
To look for the Epstein files!
peterfirefly 1y ago
Foreign policy and security policy, mostly. That mattered a lot the first time and it will matter a lot this time. Apart from that, there's absolutely no need. It would be really nice to do much more biology research under no and low gravity conditions, of course, but not at those prices.

Remind me why we need to get to the moon again?

JKCalhoun 1y ago

China will remind us soon enough.

voidUpdate 1y ago

The first time was to beat the soviets. This time is to beat china

philipwhiuk 1y ago

American Republicans have invented that it's in a race with China even though it's already been and it's not clear China thinks it's a race.

notahacker 1y ago
I suspect China thinks that dominance of space comes with superior research capability, and are delighted that the current US government is doing everything it can to sabotage that whilst fixating on a symbolic achievement which shouldn't really matter much to the US...

nilamo 1y ago

Why must there be a NEED? Why did we ever send ships across the ocean to explore? Where was the need? People like doing science, and so we're doing science.

pfdietz 1y ago
That was (for the western hemisphere) mostly to steal gold and silver from other civilizations. Oh, and to grow addictive drugs for export, like in Virginia. It was never done for other than banal reasons, although I'm sure pious rationalizations were offered to make people feel better about the ongoing genocides.
- kreetx 1y ago
  Wasn't it to discover alternative trade routes and also to show physically that the world is round? I think they didn't know that there were usable land to grow tobacco when they started.
  - mrguyorama 1y ago
    Humans have demonstrably known the world is round since at least ancient Greece. Columbus claimed it was radically smaller in diameter than previous calculations, and was begging for funding to go around the other side of the world to get a good trade route to India and China for trade goods. He was following some bad math, and adding his own worse math to the mix. People were sure he was going to die, because they did not bring enough provisions to actually go around the world.
    - pfdietz 1y ago
      Amusingly, Spain famously did set up trade to China through the New World. Silver was mined in South America and taken to China (or to the Philippines), traded for silk and other luxury goods, which were then taken back across the Pacific, over land to the Atlantic, and then on to Europe. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manila_galleon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manila_galleon
  - pfdietz 1y ago
    The first of those is banal, and the second is wrong -- they already knew the world was round, and had a more accurate estimate of the diameter than Columbus was claiming.
    - kreetx 1y ago
      Round, they knew, but still, to do it physically, was still somehow important - even for those who paid for it. Banal, depends on what you mean by this word.
- nilamo 1y ago
  That feels like a bit of rewriting the past. How could someone plan on stealing valuables from somewhere across the ocean... before they know there even is an "across the ocean" to get to? It also feels quite off to reduce all of human curiosity to a means of getting one over on someone.

pfdietz 1y ago

So we can delay dealing with the complete unrealism of our expectations of the future.

IAmBroom 1y ago

1. To avoid discussing Epstein. 2. The masses need circuses. As for bread, Marie Antoinette's press secretary said it best. 3. Trump thinks he'll corner the market on cheese.

kulahan 1y ago

For a serious answer: it's a lot cheaper to launch rockets from there, and we're running out of stuff to do in the region immediately surrounding Earth.

henryfjordan 1y ago
Is it? You have a build a whole fuel refinery on the Moon before it's worth even thinking about. And even then, you have to get whatever you want to launch to the moon in the first place...
- kulahan 1y ago
  Building the fuel refinery is a high upfront cost which will quickly disappear. The delta-V required to exit Earth's surface is nearly an order of magnitude higher than what's required to exit the Moon's surface, and the moon is full of fuel.

actionfromafar 1y ago

To look for the Epstein files!

peterfirefly 1y ago

Foreign policy and security policy, mostly. That mattered a lot the first time and it will matter a lot this time. Apart from that, there's absolutely no need. It would be really nice to do much more biology research under no and low gravity conditions, of course, but not at those prices.