4 ms·

The article sounds a cliche. The progression was always happening, nothing sudden. Just like the continuous movement of tectonic plates through the earth quakes

by zkmon 1y ago

The article sounds a cliche. The progression was always happening, nothing sudden. Just like the continuous movement of tectonic plates through the earth quakes. When tension between the plates reach a level, rupture happens. But it is not the rupture causing the tectonic movement. It is the opposite. Things like electricity, computers, internet, smartphones and AI are those earthquakes caused by the tectonic movement towards dominance of the machine. The goal of human progress was to make everything easier. Tools came up to augment human abilities, both physical and mental, so that humans can free themselves from all hard work of physical labor and thinking. We do gym and sports as the body needs some fake activity to fool it into believing that we still need all that muscle strength. We might get some gym and sports for the mind too to give it some fake activity. Remember, the goal is to preserve ourselves as physical beings while not really doing any hard work.

Froztnova 1y ago
> We might get some gym and sports for the mind too to give it some fake activity. The Factorio devs are ahead of the curve on that front I guess.
raincole 1y ago
I know it might be an offensive way to put it, but I honestly believe if AI ends up making people no longer need to use their brains as much, it's a great thing. Think about it: do we rather to live in a world where heavy labor is a necessity to make a living, or a world where we go to gym to maintain our physique? If mental labor isn't (as) necessary and people just play Scrabble or build weird Rude Goldberg machines in Minecraft to keep their minds somewhat fit, is this future really that bleak?
- ofrzeta 1y ago
  I'd say it is a constant fight against laziness. Sure it is convenient to drive everywhere with a car but at some point you might understand that it makes more sense to walk somewhere once in a while or regularly. Sure, escalators are convenient but better take the stairs so you don't need to go to the gym and save some money. If you ask me should all do more physical labour and the same goes for the mental labor. If we give that up as well the future is really bleak, to answer your question.
  - RajT88 1y ago
    Our society is laid out for cars, not walking or biking. My wife and I live about a mile from some favorite places to eat, but the walk home in the dark is dicey with a high speed limit and not a lot of lights, doubly so biking (she is not a strong pedaler). We end up driving even in the summer.
    - zkmon 1y ago
      Human settlements usually do not exceed a couple of miles in diameter, for a pedestrian life style. A person can only deal with distances around a mile or two for daily activity. Modern cities are designed for a species called cars. Humans walking in these cities would be so alien and awkward.
      - seba_dos1 1y ago
        Modern cities tend to have means for effective transport called public transit. I have lived in two big city centers and now live in one of their suburbs and I have never felt the need to own a car, even though I do have a driving license. Moving around is as easy as hopping onto a tram, metro, train or bus. In special cases there's always a possibility to call a ride. It's still more car-centric than it should be here - it's absurd how much space we waste on all these parked cars around - but fortunately it's been improving over time.
    - ofrzeta 1y ago
      In what area of the world to you live? I've been to places like that with highways and fences, it's terrible. Fortunately it's not like that in most places in Europe.
      - RajT88 1y ago
        Chicago Suburbs
- everdrive 1y ago
  The analogy here is probably physical exercise. Lack of exertion sounds great until your body falls apart and destroys itself without frequent exercise.
  - raincole 1y ago
    > where we go to gym to maintain our physique
    - Jensson 1y ago
      Average people don't do that though.
- latexr 1y ago
  It is paramount to not ignore the state of the world. Poverty, wars, inequality in the distribution of resources, accelerated natural disasters, political instability… Those aren’t going to be solved by a machine thoughtlessly regurgitating words from random text sources. Even if a world where people don’t use their brains were desirable (that’s a humungous if), the present is definitely not the time to start. If anything, we’re in dire need of the exact opposite: people using their brains to not be conned by all the bullshit being constantly streamed into our eyes and ears. And in your world, what happens when a natural disaster which wasn’t predicted takes out the AI and no one knows how to fix it? Or when the AI is blatantly and dangerously wrong but no one questions it?
  - raincole 1y ago
    I said "if." In case you're not aware, the statement following "if" is usually a hypothetical situation that might not actually happen in reality.
    - deleted 1y ago
      [deleted]
    - latexr 1y ago
      And I responded to your hypothetical in detail and followed up with a request for clarification. That’s how discussions progress and it’s what forums such as HN are designed for. You were clearly advocating for a particular future (“honestly believe (…) it’s a great thing”), so hiding behind it being a hypothetical feels disingenuous. Of course it’s an hypothetical, because it obviously does not describe the current state of the world. That doesn’t mean the idea is beyond criticism or commentary. On the contrary, that’s exactly what hypotheticals are for.
- wilsonnb3 1y ago
  It is quite bleak to me. Thinking has always been an important part of what makes us human, much more so than physical labor. Craftsmanship and tool usage are physical activities that also define us as a species and you will find no shortage of people lamenting our loss of those skills, too. Both those and thinking are categorically different than water carrying, ditch digging, and other basic heavy labor.
  - seec 1y ago
    You don't have to stop thinking. Just switch to thinking about other stuff that is more interesting to you and potentially more complicated. AI will never completely replace human thinking; it will just ease the annoying/boring parts. The same arguments were given for the innovation of the calculator, but we didn't stop thinking with math/calculations, we just make the calculator do the boring computation part (and now you can calculate with much bigger and more complexe operation without having to spend loads of times and paper for it).
- rsynnott 1y ago
  > I know it might be an offensive way to put it, but I honestly believe if AI ends up making people no longer need to use their brains as much, it's a great thing. This _might, arguably_ be true, if the output was as good as their output would have been. Very limited evidence right now, but what there is is largely not promising, eg https://www.theregister.com/2025/09/04/m365_copilot_uk_government/ https://www.theregister.com/2025/09/04/m365_copilot_uk_gover... If we end up with a society of people not thinking and producing nonsense, that seems fairly concerning.
Paratoner 1y ago
It's always the people who have no clue what they're talking about, whether in physiology or philosophy, who insist on speaking so confidently on matters of physical activity and the meaning of life. No, your reductionary argument about the purpose of something like the gym should not be "remembered". People partake in labor and even seek hardships for many individual reasons, most of which do not involve "faking" anything at all. Keep inhaling the data-ist technobro coolaid though, it's awesome to be always online.
more_corn 1y ago
The study referenced shows a sudden and dramatic drop in brain activity of people using AI to write an essay when compared to people writing an essay themselves. Writing teaches us to organize our thinking. Failing to learn to organize our thinking makes us dumb. When questioned about the contents of the essay those who used chat gpt to assist were not able to answer any questions about the paper. As though it had never happened. Imagine waking up one day and realizing this your senior year of college was over and you literally could not remember a single thing you learned that year, as though it never happened. That’s the idiocratic shift we’re seeing. AI is literally causing us to turn off our brains. A whole generation will learn nothing in school. Ask an educator how it’s going. I’ve heard from half a dozen. The consensus is “it’s a shit show”

by zkmon 1y ago

Froztnova 1y ago

> We might get some gym and sports for the mind too to give it some fake activity. The Factorio devs are ahead of the curve on that front I guess.

raincole 1y ago

I know it might be an offensive way to put it, but I honestly believe if AI ends up making people no longer need to use their brains as much, it's a great thing. Think about it: do we rather to live in a world where heavy labor is a necessity to make a living, or a world where we go to gym to maintain our physique? If mental labor isn't (as) necessary and people just play Scrabble or build weird Rude Goldberg machines in Minecraft to keep their minds somewhat fit, is this future really that bleak?

ofrzeta 1y ago
I'd say it is a constant fight against laziness. Sure it is convenient to drive everywhere with a car but at some point you might understand that it makes more sense to walk somewhere once in a while or regularly. Sure, escalators are convenient but better take the stairs so you don't need to go to the gym and save some money. If you ask me should all do more physical labour and the same goes for the mental labor. If we give that up as well the future is really bleak, to answer your question.
- RajT88 1y ago
  Our society is laid out for cars, not walking or biking. My wife and I live about a mile from some favorite places to eat, but the walk home in the dark is dicey with a high speed limit and not a lot of lights, doubly so biking (she is not a strong pedaler). We end up driving even in the summer.
  - zkmon 1y ago
    Human settlements usually do not exceed a couple of miles in diameter, for a pedestrian life style. A person can only deal with distances around a mile or two for daily activity. Modern cities are designed for a species called cars. Humans walking in these cities would be so alien and awkward.
    - seba_dos1 1y ago
      Modern cities tend to have means for effective transport called public transit. I have lived in two big city centers and now live in one of their suburbs and I have never felt the need to own a car, even though I do have a driving license. Moving around is as easy as hopping onto a tram, metro, train or bus. In special cases there's always a possibility to call a ride. It's still more car-centric than it should be here - it's absurd how much space we waste on all these parked cars around - but fortunately it's been improving over time.
  - ofrzeta 1y ago
    In what area of the world to you live? I've been to places like that with highways and fences, it's terrible. Fortunately it's not like that in most places in Europe.
    - RajT88 1y ago
      Chicago Suburbs
everdrive 1y ago
The analogy here is probably physical exercise. Lack of exertion sounds great until your body falls apart and destroys itself without frequent exercise.
- raincole 1y ago
  > where we go to gym to maintain our physique
  - Jensson 1y ago
    Average people don't do that though.
latexr 1y ago
It is paramount to not ignore the state of the world. Poverty, wars, inequality in the distribution of resources, accelerated natural disasters, political instability… Those aren’t going to be solved by a machine thoughtlessly regurgitating words from random text sources. Even if a world where people don’t use their brains were desirable (that’s a humungous if), the present is definitely not the time to start. If anything, we’re in dire need of the exact opposite: people using their brains to not be conned by all the bullshit being constantly streamed into our eyes and ears. And in your world, what happens when a natural disaster which wasn’t predicted takes out the AI and no one knows how to fix it? Or when the AI is blatantly and dangerously wrong but no one questions it?
- raincole 1y ago
  I said "if." In case you're not aware, the statement following "if" is usually a hypothetical situation that might not actually happen in reality.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
  - latexr 1y ago
    And I responded to your hypothetical in detail and followed up with a request for clarification. That’s how discussions progress and it’s what forums such as HN are designed for. You were clearly advocating for a particular future (“honestly believe (…) it’s a great thing”), so hiding behind it being a hypothetical feels disingenuous. Of course it’s an hypothetical, because it obviously does not describe the current state of the world. That doesn’t mean the idea is beyond criticism or commentary. On the contrary, that’s exactly what hypotheticals are for.
wilsonnb3 1y ago
It is quite bleak to me. Thinking has always been an important part of what makes us human, much more so than physical labor. Craftsmanship and tool usage are physical activities that also define us as a species and you will find no shortage of people lamenting our loss of those skills, too. Both those and thinking are categorically different than water carrying, ditch digging, and other basic heavy labor.
- seec 1y ago
  You don't have to stop thinking. Just switch to thinking about other stuff that is more interesting to you and potentially more complicated. AI will never completely replace human thinking; it will just ease the annoying/boring parts. The same arguments were given for the innovation of the calculator, but we didn't stop thinking with math/calculations, we just make the calculator do the boring computation part (and now you can calculate with much bigger and more complexe operation without having to spend loads of times and paper for it).
rsynnott 1y ago
> I know it might be an offensive way to put it, but I honestly believe if AI ends up making people no longer need to use their brains as much, it's a great thing. This _might, arguably_ be true, if the output was as good as their output would have been. Very limited evidence right now, but what there is is largely not promising, eg https://www.theregister.com/2025/09/04/m365_copilot_uk_government/ https://www.theregister.com/2025/09/04/m365_copilot_uk_gover... If we end up with a society of people not thinking and producing nonsense, that seems fairly concerning.

Paratoner 1y ago

It's always the people who have no clue what they're talking about, whether in physiology or philosophy, who insist on speaking so confidently on matters of physical activity and the meaning of life. No, your reductionary argument about the purpose of something like the gym should not be "remembered". People partake in labor and even seek hardships for many individual reasons, most of which do not involve "faking" anything at all. Keep inhaling the data-ist technobro coolaid though, it's awesome to be always online.

more_corn 1y ago

The study referenced shows a sudden and dramatic drop in brain activity of people using AI to write an essay when compared to people writing an essay themselves. Writing teaches us to organize our thinking. Failing to learn to organize our thinking makes us dumb. When questioned about the contents of the essay those who used chat gpt to assist were not able to answer any questions about the paper. As though it had never happened. Imagine waking up one day and realizing this your senior year of college was over and you literally could not remember a single thing you learned that year, as though it never happened. That’s the idiocratic shift we’re seeing. AI is literally causing us to turn off our brains. A whole generation will learn nothing in school. Ask an educator how it’s going. I’ve heard from half a dozen. The consensus is “it’s a shit show”