4 ms·

The score seems to be based on the number of countries you can enter without a visa. This is pretty meaningless as countries like St. Kitts and Nevis (Caribbean

The score seems to be based on the number of countries you can enter without a visa. This is pretty meaningless as countries like St. Kitts and Nevis (Caribbean, population 47,000) and China are treated as the same.

cm2187 1y ago
Also I fail to see the distinction between an ESTA/ETIAS and a visa. If I need to apply ahead of travelling, and pay a fee, and this may be denied, how is that not a visa?
- pacbard 1y ago
  Because applying for a visa takes money, time, and a visit to the embassy. ESTA/ETIAS gets automatically approved within a few minutes of paying for the fee (I guess this is true for 99.999% of applicants). Very few countries allow people to just show up and cross the border. US citizens had that privilege in a lot of places, but it looks like it’s changing now.
  - sib 1y ago
    Not true - there are plenty of countries that have e-visa (online application).
  - ghaff 1y ago
    I have never visited an embassy to get a visa--though I did cancel a couple of business trips when it became too much of an effort because of timing relative to other trips. I've travelled to a bunch of countries where I could just go through immigration with a US passport or maybe pay for a visa on arrival.
- daveoc64 1y ago
  For one, having a visa comes with a high chance of being admitted to the country (although never 100%). That is not true of schemes like ESTA or ETIAS.
  - jltsiren 1y ago
    I think it's the other way around. If you need a visa to enter, the government considers you more suspicious than those who can enter without a visa. And you will likely face more scrutiny at the border. Some countries have visa-on-arrival schemes, which are the opposite of ESTA and ETIAS. The visa still exists as a formality (maybe due to reciprocity or as a tourist tax), but you need to do little beyond paying the fee to get one.
z2 1y ago
And (admittedly maybe by design) it ignores the real important part of citizenship, which is the residence rights to your home country and beyond when you're not traveling the world. The city-state of Singapore is nice, but a French passport holder's right to live in any EU country is fantastic. Edit: Searching around, this (2018) is exactly what I had in mind--travel freedom + settlement freedom: https://www.nationalityindex.com/ https://www.nationalityindex.com/

cm2187 1y ago

Also I fail to see the distinction between an ESTA/ETIAS and a visa. If I need to apply ahead of travelling, and pay a fee, and this may be denied, how is that not a visa?

pacbard 1y ago
Because applying for a visa takes money, time, and a visit to the embassy. ESTA/ETIAS gets automatically approved within a few minutes of paying for the fee (I guess this is true for 99.999% of applicants). Very few countries allow people to just show up and cross the border. US citizens had that privilege in a lot of places, but it looks like it’s changing now.
- sib 1y ago
  Not true - there are plenty of countries that have e-visa (online application).
- ghaff 1y ago
  I have never visited an embassy to get a visa--though I did cancel a couple of business trips when it became too much of an effort because of timing relative to other trips. I've travelled to a bunch of countries where I could just go through immigration with a US passport or maybe pay for a visa on arrival.
daveoc64 1y ago
For one, having a visa comes with a high chance of being admitted to the country (although never 100%). That is not true of schemes like ESTA or ETIAS.
- jltsiren 1y ago
  I think it's the other way around. If you need a visa to enter, the government considers you more suspicious than those who can enter without a visa. And you will likely face more scrutiny at the border. Some countries have visa-on-arrival schemes, which are the opposite of ESTA and ETIAS. The visa still exists as a formality (maybe due to reciprocity or as a tourist tax), but you need to do little beyond paying the fee to get one.

z2 1y ago

And (admittedly maybe by design) it ignores the real important part of citizenship, which is the residence rights to your home country and beyond when you're not traveling the world. The city-state of Singapore is nice, but a French passport holder's right to live in any EU country is fantastic. Edit: Searching around, this (2018) is exactly what I had in mind--travel freedom + settlement freedom: https://www.nationalityindex.com/ https://www.nationalityindex.com/