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>And if they really tied their livelihood to working at the same company for next decade because they maxed out their lifestyle relative to the income generated

>And if they really tied their livelihood to working at the same company for next decade because they maxed out their lifestyle relative to the income generated by that company, then that falls all on them and I don't actually feel that bad for them. I'd say that there's some room for nuance there. Tech hiring has slowed significantly, such that even people in senior roles who get laid off may be looking for a long time. If you work for Microsoft you're not getting top tier comp already (at least as compared with many other tech companies), and then on top of that you're required to work out of a V/HCOL city. Add in the expenses of a family, which have risen dramatically the last few years, and it's easy to find examples of people who are starting to get stretched paycheck to paycheck who weren't having that issue a couple of years ago. Check the prices in Seattle, SF, LA, DC, and NYC metro areas for 2-4 bedroom rentals and how they've jumped the last few years. You're looking at 35%-45% of their take home pay just on rent even before utilities. I'm not sure the math works out all that well for people trying to support a family, even with both parents working.

teiferer 1y ago
> Add in the expenses of a family, which have risen dramatically the last few years, and it's easy to find examples of people who are starting to get stretched paycheck to paycheck If you maxed out your lifestyle relative to your income then yes, that is the case. It will always be, no matter how much you make. It's also the case for the guy stocking the shelves at your local Walmart if he maxes out his lifestyle. But if you compare both in absolute terms, there are huge differences. Which lifestyle you have is your choice. How big of a house, what car, where to eat, hobbies, clothes, how many kids, etc. If you max that out, fine, enjoy it. But own that it was your choice and comes with consequences, i.e., if expenses rise more than income, then suddenly your personal economy is stretched. And that's on you.
- hitarpetar 1y ago
  it's interesting watching people work so hard to not feel empathy
  - teiferer 1y ago
    It's possible to feel empathy and at the same time pointing out the consequences of somebody's choices. If my kid places his hands on a hot stovetop then I feel a lot of empathy and will obviously comfort him. But I won't run around claiming to the world that external forces made him do it. It was his choice. If it was his first time and/or nobody told him that it's a bad idea then there is limited responsibility, but otherwise it's squarely on him. Despite me feeling and expressing empathy.
    - hitarpetar 1y ago
      I wonder if you can use your empathetic powers to imagine that layoffs might negatively affect some well paid engineers who are NOT fiscally irresponsible victims of lifestyle inflation

teiferer 1y ago

> Add in the expenses of a family, which have risen dramatically the last few years, and it's easy to find examples of people who are starting to get stretched paycheck to paycheck If you maxed out your lifestyle relative to your income then yes, that is the case. It will always be, no matter how much you make. It's also the case for the guy stocking the shelves at your local Walmart if he maxes out his lifestyle. But if you compare both in absolute terms, there are huge differences. Which lifestyle you have is your choice. How big of a house, what car, where to eat, hobbies, clothes, how many kids, etc. If you max that out, fine, enjoy it. But own that it was your choice and comes with consequences, i.e., if expenses rise more than income, then suddenly your personal economy is stretched. And that's on you.

hitarpetar 1y ago
it's interesting watching people work so hard to not feel empathy
- teiferer 1y ago
  It's possible to feel empathy and at the same time pointing out the consequences of somebody's choices. If my kid places his hands on a hot stovetop then I feel a lot of empathy and will obviously comfort him. But I won't run around claiming to the world that external forces made him do it. It was his choice. If it was his first time and/or nobody told him that it's a bad idea then there is limited responsibility, but otherwise it's squarely on him. Despite me feeling and expressing empathy.
  - hitarpetar 1y ago
    I wonder if you can use your empathetic powers to imagine that layoffs might negatively affect some well paid engineers who are NOT fiscally irresponsible victims of lifestyle inflation